O 010614Z JUL 09
FM AMEMBASSY BEIJING
TO SECSTATE WASHDC IMMEDIATE 4963
INFO CHINA POSTS COLLECTIVE
NSC WASHDC
AIT TAIPEI 7344
CIA WASHINGTON DC
SECDEF WASHINGTON DC
JOINT STAFF WASHINGTON DC
DIA WASHINGTON DC
CDR USPACOM HONOLULU HI

C O N F I D E N T I A L BEIJING 001835 
 
 
DEPARTMENT FOR EAP, ISN. JOINT STAFF FOR J5 
 
E.O. 12958: DECL: 06/23/2034 
TAGS: PREL PARM MOPS EAID IR AF PK
SUBJECT: 2009 U.S.-CHINA DEFENSE CONSULTATIVE TALKS (DCT), 
SESSION 3 PART 2: AFGHANISTAN/PAKISTAN AND IRAN 
 
Classified By: Classified by ADCM William Weinstein. 
Reasons 1.4 (b) and (d). 
 
Summary 
------- 
 
¶1. (C)  During U.S.-China Defense Consultative Talks June 
24, 2009, Michele Flournoy, Under Secretary of Defense for 
Policy (USDP) presented the U.S. perspective on the 
situation in Afghanistan and Pakistan, stressing the 
importance of China's role in the region.  PRC military 
officials perceived different underlying causes for the 
situations in Afghanistan and Pakistan, viewing the problem 
in Afghanistan as essentially political and instability in 
Pakistan as stemming from the security situation.  China is 
still considering the U.S. request to ship non-lethal 
supplies through PRC territory in support of Afghanistan 
stabilization efforts, urged the U.S. not to apply a 
"double-standard" in labeling terrorist groups, and 
asserted that Chinese Uighurs released from Guantanamo 
should be repatriated to China.  The PLA identified a 
"window of opportunity" for progress on the Iranian nuclear 
issue, but admitted that Tehran might not be ready to talk, 
and the possibility for strategic miscalculation between 
Iran and Israel posed another possible obstacle to progress. 
End Summary. 
 
U.S. Views on Security and Stability in Afghanistan and 
Pakistan 
--------------------------------------------- --------- 
 
¶2. (C)  Leading off the discussion on Afghanistan and 
Pakistan, USDP described the two countries as priority 
areas of interest for the Obama administration, and 
conveyed the United States' hope that China would use its 
relations with the Pakistani military to urge the latter to 
focus on combating the insurgency and extremism.  Craig 
Mullaney, Principal Director for Central Asia in the Office 
of the Secretary of Defense, briefed the Afghanistan- 
Pakistan Strategic Review, stressing that the U.S. has a 
vital national interest in security threats posed by 
extremists in Afghanistan and Pakistan, and outlining the 
primary U.S. objectives in the region. EAP/CM Director David 
Shear told the PLA that U.S.-China cooperation is a 
necessary part of the international community's 
stabilization efforts in the region, and stressed that the 
U.S. does not seek hegemony in the region or to displace 
China's influence in Pakistan. 
 
PLA View: Afghanistan and Pakistan Are Fundamentally 
Different Problems 
--------------------------------------------- --------- 
 
¶3. (C)  MG Yang Hui, Director of the PLA Intelligence 
Department, presented China's views on Afghanistan and 
Pakistan, noting that the two countries neighbor China and 
that China seeks peace and stability in the region.  China 
wants to avoid conflict between Pakistan and India, and 
seeks to ensure that terrorist groups do not go unchecked in 
the region.  MG Yang stressed that China sees the situations 
in Afghanistan and Pakistan as having different underlying 
causes, with the problem in Afghanistan essentially being 
political while the root cause of the instability in 
Pakistan is a security issue.  He noted that throughout its 
history Afghanistan has never enjoyed a strong central 
government, and tribal leadership had always had strong 
influence.  The Taliban currently control over 70 percent of 
the territory and seek to take back control of the entire 
country, making the government's struggle against them a 
struggle for survival.  In contrast, MG Yang claimed, the 
Pakistan issue was an internal security matter, and the 
Pakistan government's top priority should be to prevent the 
Taliban from spreading within Pakistan, 
as well as supporting stabilization efforts.  He added that 
the differing root causes should indicate to the 
international community that outsiders should respect the 
two countries' sovereignty and territorial integrity and 
take "comprehensive" counterterrorism measures. 
 
¶4. (C)  China, MG Yang observed, remains a developing 
country and contributes to the two countries "to the best of 
its ability," including US$180 million in assistance to 
Afghanistan and the cancellation of official debt.  In the 
next five years, Yang reported, China would provide an 
additional US$75 million as well as 31 million RMB in 
military assistance.  For Pakistan, China provided a US$100 
million grant in April 2008 and has decided to provide an 
additional 60 million RMB to assist internally displaced 
persons there. 
 
¶5. (C)  MG Yang noted that the Obama administration's new 
approach on Afghanistan and Pakistan marks a major 
departure from the previous administration, especially in 
its comprehensive emphasis on political, economic and 
international efforts in addition to military actions.  He 
stressed that China is sincere in its emphasis on 
U.S.-China cooperation in the region. 
 
Non-Lethal Shipping Request, Guantanamo Uighurs 
--------------------------------------------- -- 
 
¶6. (C)  USDP reiterated the U.S. request to use commercial 
shipping to move non-lethal supplies across China to support 
international efforts to stabilize Afghanistan. Lieutenant 
General Ma Xiaotian, Deputy Chief of the PLA General Staff 
replied that China has received the request, but numerous 
agencies within the PRC government need to consider the 
proposal before making a decision.  Linking the U.S. request 
to PRC concerns, LTG Ma then referenced China's interest in 
the connections terrorist groups in Afghanistan and Pakistan 
might have with separatist forces within China.  LTG Ma 
claimed that many of these forces trained in Central Asia, 
and asked that the U.S. not apply a "double-standard" in 
determining terrorist groups and 
individuals.  He raised the example of "terrorists" that 
were being released from Guantanamo, complaining that the 16 
Uighurs in that group should be sent back to China but were 
instead being relocated to third countries.  EAP/CM Director 
Shear responded that the United States previously explained 
the Guantanamo closure process to the Chinese and that many 
opportunities remain for U.S.-China cooperation 
on Afghanistan and Pakistan. 
 
¶7. (C)  LTG Ma presented China's assessment that Central 
Asia was serving as a training ground and base of 
operations for terrorist groups and that the security 
situation in Afghanistan and Pakistan has a strong impact on 
security in northwest China, giving China a special 
"interest (in) and responsibility" for regional stability. 
China is willing to work with the international community to 
"do its part," he asserted.  China enjoys a long-term 
strategic partnership with Pakistan at various levels of 
government, LTG Ma noted, and China employs these channels 
of communication to support counter-terrorism efforts in 
Pakistan. 
 
The PLA's View of Iran 
---------------------- 
 
¶8. (C)  Turning to Iran, MG Yang remarked that China 
clearly supports the international nuclear nonproliferation 
regime and opposes Iran's development of nuclear weapons. He 
maintained that China supports the international community's 
efforts to resolve the issue through diplomacy 
and that the U.S. and China enjoy strong communication and 
coordination on the issue.  He observed that there is at 
present a "window of opportunity" for progress on the 
nuclear issue.  In MG Yang's view, Iranian nuclear 
development was driven by three factors: 1) its own 
national security concerns, 2) a desire to increase its 
role in the Middle East, and 3) a need to enhance 
internalpolitical coherence. 
 
¶9. (C)  MG Yang noted that the U.S. government has signaled 
its intention to improve relations with Iran and is prepared 
to remove forces from Iraq, and that the Iranian side has 
taken a more positive attitude as a result.  He suggested 
that, by strengthening alliances among Shia outside Iran, 
Tehran's influence in the region has increased.  The result 
is that many in Iran argue that Tehran's hard-line position 
vis-a-vis the U.S. should be relaxed.  MG Yang added that 
the effort to develop nuclear weapons has not proven to be a 
unifying political force for Iran.  He argued that, in light 
of these developments, now was the time for engagement and 
negotiations with Tehran while showing respect for its 
security concerns. 
 
¶10. (C)  MG Yang cautioned, however, that two major 
obstacles to progress remained. First, it remains unclear if 
Iran was willing to enter into negotiations.  From the 
Iranian perspective, MG Yang claimed, recent U.S. overtures 
could be seen as a victory for the Iranian revolution. 
Before the recent election in Iran, both major candidates 
announced that the U.S should be prepared to make 
concessions before talks could begin. 
 
¶11. (C)  Second, MG Yang cautioned that there remains the 
possibility of strategic miscalculation between Iran and 
Israel.  In contrast to recent improvements in Iran's 
perception of its security environment, Israel has a grim 
assessment of the Iran nuclear issue, and has labeled Iran 
the most urgent threat to its survival.  According to MG 
Yang, Israel has announced its intention to strike Iranian 
nuclear facilities with military force if increased U.S. 
engagement with Iran fails to show progress.  Iran has 
labeled Israel a "tumor" on the region and was supporting 
anti-Israel forces.  Strategic miscalculation would lead to 
the potential for serious turbulence in the region.  MG Yang 
reported that China is talking to Iran through many channels 
to emphasize the importance of cooperation with the 
international community, and stressed that the resumption of 
talks is in Iran's own interest.  USDP expressed 
appreciation for China's restraint on arms sales to Iran and 
said she hoped this will continue until the issue is 
resolved.  She also urged China to abide by international 
sanctions against Iran. 
 
December 2007 NIE 
---------------- 
 
¶12. (C)  MG Yang asked the U.S. delegation whether the 
assessment of the Iranian nuclear weapons program announced 
in the December 2007 National Intelligence Estimate still 
applies.  Robert Gromoll, State Department Acting Director 
from ISN asserted that it does, but noted that the recent 
IAEA Director General's report on the Iranian nuclear issue 
contained clear danger signals, including the possibility of 
undeclared nuclear activities and a military dimension to 
the nuclear program.  USDP added that Iran's continued 
enrichment activities would in time give Iran a breakout 
capability. 
 
¶13. (U)  U.S. Participants: 
 
Michele Flournoy, Under Secretary of Defense for Policy 
(USDP); Dan Piccuta, Charge d'Affaires; Michael Schiffer, 
Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense (DASD); for East Asia 
David Shear, EAP/CM, Department of State; Brig Gen Joseph 
Callahan, Deputy Director for Politico-Military Affairs - 
Asia, Joint Staff J5; Brig Gen William Uhle, USPACOM Deputy 
J5; RDML Bradley Gerhrke, U.S. Defense Attache in Beijing; 
John Plumb, OSD Principal Director for Nuclear and Missile 
Defense Policy; Craig Mullaney, OSD Principal Director for 
Central Asia; Robert Gromoll Acting Director for Regional 
Affairs ISN, Department of State. 
 
¶14. (U)  PRC Participants 
 
Lieutenant General Ma Xiaotian, Deputy Chief of the PLA 
General Staff; Major General Qian Lihua, Director, Ministry 
of National Defense Foreign Affairs Office (MND/FAO); Major 
General Yang Hui, Director, Intelligence Department, PLA 
General Staff Department; 
Rear Admiral Yi Changzhi, Deputy Chief of Staff, PLA Navy; 
Major General Zhu Chenghu, Director, Department of 
International Strategic Studies, PLA National Defense 
University (NDU); Senior Captain Guan Youfei, Deputy 
Director, MND/FAO; Senior Colonel Wang Kebin, Deputy 
Director, Operations Department, PLA General Staff 
Department; Major General Zhao Ning, PRC Defense Attache in 
Washington; Senior Captain Li Ji, Director, North American 
and Oceania Bureau, MND/FAO; Councilor Ma Zhanwu, North 
American and Oceania Affairs, MFA; 
Lieutenant Colonel Chu Weiwei, Interpreter, MND/FAO 
 
¶15. (U)  USDP has cleared this cable. 
 
GOLDBERG