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O 191123Z AUG 09
FM AMEMBASSY PHNOM PENH
TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC IMMEDIATE 1080
INFO RUCNASE/ASEAN MEMBER COLLECTIVE IMMEDIATE
RUCNDT/USMISSION USUN NEW YORK IMMEDIATE 2405
RHEHNSC/NSC WASHDC IMMEDIATE 0181
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C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 03 PHNOM PENH 000602 
 
SIPDIS 
 
STATE FOR EAP/MLS, P, D, DRL, IO 
 
E.O. 12958: DECL: 08/19/2019 
TAGS: PREL PGOV ETRD EAID PTER MASS KJUS PHUM BM CB
SUBJECT: SENATOR WEBB MEETING WITH PRIME MINISTER HUN SEN 
 
REF: STATE 83598 
 
Classified By: AMBASSADOR CAROL A. RODLEY FOR REASONS 1.4 (B,D) 
 
¶1.  (C) SUMMARY: Senator Jim Webb concluded a successful 
one-day visit to Cambodia August 18 on a positive note during 
a meeting with Prime Minister Hun Sen in which there was 
general agreement on new ways to approach Burma.  Webb 
detailed his interest in the region and in stronger relations 
with Cambodia.  Hun Sen repeated support for the ASEAN 
position on Burma, saying that Aung San Suu Kyi should be 
freed, the military government should be dissolved, and 
elections held.  He agreed that ASEAN should do more to 
influence the Burmese junta, noted that sanctions could only 
drive Burma into the arms of China and India, and outlined 
possible options for Burma toward planned 2010 elections. 
Hun Sen praised warming relations with the United States, 
citing CT cooperation, the Peace Corps, and a Cambodia-hosted 
GPOI exercise in 2010.  He also related Cambodia's efforts to 
achieve resolution of a border dispute with Thailand by 
peaceful means.  END SUMMARY. 
 
¶2.  (C) Accompanied by the Ambassador, Senator Webb called on 
the Prime Minister in his National Assembly office, where he 
was joined by MFA Secretary of State Ouch Borith, Senior 
Minister and National Counter Terrorism Center (NCTC) Deputy 
Director Om Yentieng, and foreign relations advisor Srey 
Thamarong.  Recounting his 40 years experience in the region 
and noting his current position as Chairman of the SFRC East 
Asian and Pacific Affairs Sub-Committee, Senator Webb 
explained his abiding interest in maintaining U.S. 
involvement in Southeast Asia, particularly in the five 
mainland countries he is visiting on this trip.  He said that 
the new importance placed on the region was shared by fellow 
Senators and noted that he would report to the Secretary upon 
his return, especially on means to improve bilateral 
relations.  Based on his long experience in Vietnam, he 
asserted that the U.S. needed to engage Cambodia in the same 
way it did in Vietnam 12 years ago.  While the present state 
of relations with Cambodia was "very good," he underscored 
that the U.S. and Cambodia were set to mature into a more 
positive and productive relationship. 
 
¶3.  (C) Hun Sen thanked the Senator for his interest in 
Cambodia and the region, noting that since President Obama 
took office there has been a noticeable improvement in 
American interest in Southeast Asia.  Recalling former 
President Clinton's past visit to Phnom Penh and his recent 
success in North Korea, Hun Sen attributed the more intense 
focus on Asia to new leadership in the U.S. and also to the 
continued interest in fighting terrorism on the global stage. 
 Citing his three sons' experience in CT-related military 
endeavors -- one leading the U.S.-supported National Counter 
Terrorism Security Forces (NCTSF) and another studying at the 
U.S. National Defense University --  he said that relations 
between Cambodia and the U.S. were at a high point. 
 
New Embassy and Old Kerry Mission: Strong Bilateral Ties 
--------------------------------------------- ----------- 
 
¶4.  (C) Hun Sen remarked on the new embassy compound (NEC) 
next to Phnom Penh's historic Wat Phnom as a tangible 
indicator of deepening relations.  Before, the USG never 
owned property in Cambodia, he said.  And if it were anyone 
but the American government making the request for such a 
historic site, he said that the government would likely have 
not allowed an embassy to be built there.  He recalled the 
difficult U.S.-Cambodia relationship in the 1960's and early 
1970's, when Cambodian youths saw the American embassy as a 
symbol of hatred and were incited to burn it down, noting 
that he was one of those youths.  Now, nearly forty years 
later, the embassy is a sign of a permanent U.S. presence 
welcomed by all Cambodians, and the government now only 
wished to protect it so that the U.S. could broaden its work 
in Cambodia. 
 
¶5.  (C) The Prime Minister conveyed his regards to SFRC 
Chairman John Kerry, whose helpful mission to Cambodia a 
decade ago was cited as another example of enduring ties. 
Hun Sen recalled Kerry's two successes with the Khmer Rouge 
Tribunal: developing a new "super-majority" vote formula that 
helped define the hybrid court (with a majority of national 
judges) on terms acceptable to the UN, and the implementation 
of a Pre-Trial Chamber to decide on the scope of 
prosecutions.  The formulas Senator Kerry helped develop have 
turned out to be significant to the procedures of the court, 
he said, concluding that Senator Kerry had always sought the 
means to make the court a success. 
 
PHNOM PENH 00000602  002 OF 003 
 
 
 
Burma: Flexibility a Success 
---------------------------- 
 
¶6.  (C) Hun Sen praised Senator Webb for his successful trip 
to Burma, noting that he had not been able to see both Than 
Shwe and Aung San Suu Kyi during his own previous visits. 
The additional success in obtaining the release of an 
American prisoner showed that it was not at all an ordinary 
mission.  This success was based on a more flexible position 
resulting in "no loss at all" to the U.S., Hun Sen said. 
 
¶7.  (C) Senator Webb recounted his last trip to Burma eight 
years ago when a business run by an American friend was 
suffering in part due to sanctions, with consequences being 
felt by the local Burmese staff his friend had trained. 
Looking at Burma through the prism of his experience in 
Vietnam, the Senator opined that Vietnam's greater exposure 
to the outside world had been better for the Vietnamese 
people than when trade sanctions were imposed.  He is now 
bringing the same approach to Burma, he explained.  Just as 
in Vietnam, he was trying to speak to all parties in Burma 
and to deliver the same message consistently.  He believed 
the Burmese government understood this approach, which is why 
he was able to see both Tan Shwe and Aung San Suu Kyi. 
 
Options for Burma's Future 
------------------------- 
 
¶8.  (C) Senator Webb explained that he understood from 
meetings in Bangkok that ASEAN leaders were considering 
sending a joint letter to leadership in Burma seeking amnesty 
for Aung San Suu Kyi.  The Senator urged Hun Sen to consider 
joining in that letter.  Recounting that it was difficult for 
other ASEAN nations to have a dialogue with Burma's 
leadership, Hun Sen said that Cambodia adopted the ASEAN 
position on next steps for Burma:  release Aung San Suu Kyi, 
get rid of the military government, and embrace democracy. 
However, he underscored that sanctions were of no use to 
ASEAN's interests; they have caused the group to have less 
influence over developments in Burma, and have pushed Burma 
closer to China and India. 
 
¶9.  (C) On the upcoming elections, Hun Sen outlined two 
options: (1) release ASSK and allow her to participate in 
elections;  or, (2) encourage elections with participation by 
Aung San Suu Kyi's party: the National League for Democracy 
(NLD).  He asserted that the first option is preferable, for 
both Burma and ASEAN, but at the very least, Burma must hold 
elections with the participation of NLD.  Then all can say 
that a vote for NLD is a vote for Aung San Suu Kyi.  If her 
party were to win the election, then it could amend the 
constitution to release her.  Hun Sen added that even if 
under house arrest, Aung San Suu Kyi should allow her party 
to participate because it would benefit from her network of 
support throughout the country. 
 
¶10.  (C) Paraphrasing points from reftel, Senator Webb agreed 
that Burma should release Aung San Suu Kyi and at the same 
time call on her party to participate in elections.  Such a 
move might give the government credibility, he noted.  Even 
if the party chose not to participate, the world would be 
aware of the circumstances, he added.  More importantly, 
there was great significance to ASEAN saying something about 
the issue.  The top leadership of Burma is very isolated, and 
Senator Webb emphasized the value of their hearing ASEAN 
views.  Hun Sen replied that ASEAN leaders always try to 
share their views with Burma and that they tried to help push 
Burma's leaders.  Although in the past ASEAN could not speak 
without offending Burma, now they will work in a concerted 
effort because there is only one year left before the planned 
elections. 
 
Cambodia's Future With Thailand and the United States 
--------------------------------------------- -------- 
 
¶11.  (C) Turning to Cambodia, Hun Sen noted that the nation 
shared a different fate from Vietnam and Laos in that after 
the Indochina war, Cambodians suffered under a regime of 
genocide.  Phnom Penh 30 years ago had no people.  Now, only 
11 years after the end of the Khmer Rouge, Cambodia was 
beginning to emerge into a more sustained period of peace and 
stability.  His government was committed to rebuilding the 
country, working with donors, and developing a nation run by 
the rule of law. 
 
¶12.  (C) As for its border dispute with Thailand, Hun Sen 
said that Cambodia was trying to be patient and to solve the 
 
PHNOM PENH 00000602  003 OF 003 
 
 
border problems by peaceful means.  While the troops are 
trying to shake hands, have celebrations together, and avoid 
armed clashes, the RGC was looking at "the whole jungle and 
not just one tree."  First, Cambodia was trying to contain 
the border dispute to just one area.  Secondly, Cambodia was 
actively promoting cross-border exchanges, tourism, trade and 
investment with Thailand.  Cambodia was waiting for the Thai 
parliament to adopt agreed-upon measures to re-deploy troops 
now at the border, to begin a program of landmine removal, 
and to work together on border demarcation.  (NOTE: These 
measures have been adopted in bilaterally negotiated joint 
communiques that have received RGC approval and reportedly 
await only the approval of the Thai parliament. END NOTE.) 
 
¶13.  (C) Hun Sen then praised the evolution of 
Cambodian-United States relations.  Again referring to his 
youth when Cambodians were incited to demonstrate against the 
American embassy, he highlighted that now Cambodian youth are 
being taught by Peace Corps volunteers who live alongside 
them.  Cambodian goods are now widely available in American 
markets, and the Prime Minister asked Senator Webb to 
continue to support the import of Cambodian goods and to 
encourage American investment in order to help employment in 
Cambodia.  He also cited progress in other areas.  Next year, 
Cambodia would play host to many nations participating in the 
GPOI Capstone exercises, largely with the help of the United 
States.  Cambodia also joined cooperatively in 
counter-terrorism efforts, such as a regional CT seminar 
sponsored by the Asia Pacific Center for Security Studies 
(APCSS) which he had helped open with the Ambassador the day 
before. 
 
Aid with PROTECT Act Cases 
-------------------------- 
 
¶14.  (C) Hun Sen told Senator Webb and the Ambassador that he 
agreed to the Embassy's request to remove three Americans to 
the U.S. to face charges of illicit sexual conduct under the 
PROTECT Act.  Based on advice from the RGC Ministry of 
Justice, Hun Sen clarified that the U.S. should seek the 
"return" of the individuals under escort by U.S. law 
enforcement authorities, rather than their "expulsion."  The 
Ambassador thanked Hun Sen for his concurrence, and promised 
expeditious follow-up on the U.S. side. 
 
¶15.  (C) Senator Webb and Hun Sen concluded with an exchange 
of pleasantries in Vietnamese.  Hun Sen remarked that he 
learned his Vietnamese while in a Vietnamese jail in 1977 
(NOTE: just after fleeing from the Khmer Rouge Eastern Zone 
to escape KR purges.  END NOTE), and noted that Senator 
Webb's Vietnamese was better than his own. 
 
¶16.  (C) COMMENT:  Hun Sen clearly was prepared to engage 
productively on Burma, and sees a role for the RGC as a 
bridge between the Burmese junta and ASEAN given Cambodia's 
own progress toward democracy since the 1991 Paris Peace 
Accords.  On the bilateral relationship, Hun Sen hit all the 
high marks and was clearly motivated to stay on message and 
outline a positive vision for Cambodia's future.  Senator 
Webb's overall presentation -- especially his emphasis on 
democracy in Burma --  provided Hun Sen with welcome insight 
about Washington's engagement in Southeast Asia.  The 
Senator's approach to engagement likely was helpful in 
securing agreement to turn over custody of three Americans to 
U.S. law enforcement after several weeks of ponderous RGC 
consideration.  It has been nearly two years since the last 
Congressional visit to Cambodia.  Senator Webb's visit and 
his practical engagement throughout the course of a single 
day has likely reinforced both the equilibrium and depth of 
the bilateral agenda so that, while we understand clearly we 
will not always agree, our objectives for the future of the 
country and the region are not in doubt. 
RODLEY