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UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 03 NEW DELHI 000965 
 
SIPDIS 
 
SIPDIS 
 
STATE FOR OES/PCI, OES/EGC, AND SCA/INS 
DEPT OF ENERGY FOR TCUTLER, CGILLESPIE, MGINZBERG 
USDOC FOR A/S BOHIGIAN 
NSC FOR DAN PRICE 
CEQ FOR JAMES CONNAUGHTON 
 
E.O. 12958: N/A 
TAGS: SENV ENRG ECON TSPL TRGY KSCA KGHG IN
SUBJECT:  CODEL PELOSI ENGAGES INDIAN ENERGY EXPERTS ON CLIMATE 
CHANGE 
 
NEW DELHI 00000965  001.2 OF 003 
 
 
¶1.  SUMMARY:  The Energy and Resources Institute (TERI), 
Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) Chairman Dr. R.K. 
Pachauri's powerful NGO, brought out its leading experts to brief 
CODEL Pelosi on climate change and answer questions in a roundtable 
meeting held at the TERI Gram Campus in Gurgaon.  Pachauri pulled no 
punches and neither did Dr. Prodipto Ghosh or Ambassador 
Chandrashekher Dasgupta, both of whom are Distinguished Fellows at 
TERI and special advisors to Prime Minister Singh on Climate Change. 
 CODEL Pelosi responded with a series of questions on the best way 
to move forward in combating climate change including increased 
international cooperation, deforestation, and the role of both 
developed and developing countries in finding a solution to the 
global problem.  END SUMMARY. 
 
¶2.  Dr. Pachauri began the discussion by recounting the incident at 
the Bali Conference of Parties in December 2007 when a 
representative of Papua New Guinea told the U.S. delegation in open 
session to "lead or get out of the way."  Pachauri, who considers 
the United States a second home, said he was dismayed by the broad 
support given to the representative of Papua New Guinea and the 
thunderous applause that followed his statement.  Pachauri was 
assured by several members of CODEL Pelosi that there would be no 
call for such statements in the future as the U.S. assumed a greater 
leadership role on climate change. 
 
-------------------------------- 
TERI CLAIMS INDIA IS DOING ITS PART 
-------------------------------- 
 
¶3.  Ambassador Dasgupta laid out the Government of India's (GOI) 
position that all countries must make an effort to adapt to climate 
change and mitigate its effects pursuant to common but 
differentiated responsibilities.  He noted that PM Singh announced 
the GOI is drafting a comprehensive climate change action plan to be 
adopted by June 2008.  Although the plan is not finalized, Dasgupta 
provided a sense of what it will contain by characterizing India as 
a poor country with low coping capacity to deal with the effects of 
climate change.  He stated industrialized countries can cope better 
due to stronger infrastructure and that India must build its 
infrastructure in order to deal with the growing threat. 
 
¶4.  Dr. Ghosh also played up India's developing country status by 
noting it was imperative for India to provide energy to the 400 
million people who have no access to energy today.  He went on to 
rattle off India's poverty statistics, noting one-third of India's 
citizens live on less than a dollar a day while three-fifths live on 
less than two dollars a day.  He stated India needed to grow for the 
next 20 to 25 years, but highlighted India's commitment to 
mitigation by noting the country has a very aggressive program on 
renewables and an energy efficiency law requiring major buildings 
and industrial enterprises to have an annual energy audit.  He 
stated the last 15 years have shown a steady decline in India's 
energy intensity and that India surpassed Germany and was close to 
Japan in terms of energy intensity.  He also noted India has 
committed 2.67% of its GDP to address climate variability, floods, 
droughts, vector borne disease, and extreme weather events.  Ghosh 
concluded by claiming India has a solid slate of policy measures to 
address adaptation and mitigation. 
 
------------------ 
CHINA VERSUS INDIA 
------------------ 
 
¶5.  Congressman Miller noted that, during the negotiations leading 
up to the Kyoto Protocol, the Chinese took a very strong "develop 
first - clean up later" view but that now it seems like the gap in 
perspective on climate change between developed and developing 
countries is narrowing. Pachauri responded by stating China is 
convinced it will suffer greatly from climate change.  He said 
China's Premier Wen Jiabao  believes in the necessity to address the 
issue but that the economic development council is still maintaining 
a development at any cost attitude. 
 
¶6.  Dr. Ghosh took a different tack by highlighting the differences 
between India and China.  He stated India didn't have the same 
debate China did in the run-up to Kyoto because India had already 
 
NEW DELHI 00000965  002.2 OF 003 
 
 
put in place policies to promote food security and environmental 
conservation, and to address climate change.  India has never been 
complacent about environmental damage due to growth, he said. 
Echoing Ghosh's statements, Pachauri remarked that India is "keen on 
the environment" and that large hydropower projects, such as China's 
three gorges dam, won't be built in India because they would never 
pass environmental muster.  Dasgupta added that another difference 
between the two countries was the role of the courts in 
environmental protection, citing the Public Interest Litigation case 
which brought CNG to Delhi's public transport system as an example. 
 
 
--------------------------------------------- -- 
DEFORESTATION, REFORESTATION, AND AFFORESTATION 
--------------------------------------------- -- 
 
¶7.  The delegation raised the importance of forests in combating 
climate change and asked for TERI's opinion on structuring credits 
for avoiding deforestation and promoting reforestation.  Pachauri 
answered that the problem with credits in this context is 
verification.  Dasgupta took the point further, noting that it was 
not enough to reward countries for not destroying their forests, but 
that it was important to incentivize afforestation.  He expressed 
disappointment that afforestation projects are not supported under 
the Clean Development Mechanism, as forestry was a major part of any 
future climate change mitigation regime. 
 
--------------- 
THE WAY FORWARD 
--------------- 
 
¶8.  According to Ghosh, the key to moving forward was equity.  He 
stated no international agreement on climate change would stand if 
it was perceived as inequitable, and that any agreement must be seen 
as fair to be sustainable.  He also noted there were currently three 
energy flows that could replace fossil fuels - nuclear, solar, and 
biomass - but that the world needed more international cooperation 
on research and development to bring down costs in order to make 
these technologies competitive with fossil fuels.  Asked for TERI's 
opinion on how such international cooperation in research should be 
structured, Pachauri responded that there was no need for new 
institutions, but rather a need for new programs with a focus on 
specific goals.  He suggested that a USG agency, such as the 
National Science Foundation, should setup a task force in which 
international partners could develop new techniques together.  Dr. 
Ghosh suggested setting up a venture capital fund in an institution 
such as the World Bank which would fund competitive proposals for 
research and development.  The fund could use the framework of the 
Asia Pacific Partnership on Clean Development and Climate, he added, 
noting that it had worked well. 
 
¶9.  Congressman Markey inquired what India's goal for wind and solar 
power was in the context of the nuclear deal. The nuclear deal was 
just a beginning, Pachauri stated, while, India should have 40 - 50 
MW in wind power over the next 15 years.  There was still a lot of 
work to be done on solar power, he noted, adding that he hoped to 
see 100 MW solar plants in a few years. 
 
¶10.  Paul Pelosi asked Pachauri whether the private sector in India 
had become involved in green technology, and whether the private 
sector saw combating climate change as an economic opportunity. 
Pachauri replied that there had not been much focus by the private 
sector in the past, but that it was growing and on the verge of 
takeoff. 
 
¶11.  Several members of the delegation noted that the scientists 
continued to shorten the period in which to act and asked what could 
be done to address climate change in the short term.  Pachauri 
remarked that all the technologies needed to win the battle were 
available now, and that there were good stories from around the 
world.  For example, the average number of miles driven in Japan had 
come down in recent years due to an increase in public 
transportation.  He went on to state "it's not rocket science" and 
that we needed to shift priorities, advance public transport, focus 
on energy efficient buildings, and put a price on carbon to 
incentivize the process. 
 
NEW DELHI 00000965  003.2 OF 003 
 
 
 
¶12.  COMMENT:  Considering Dr. Ghosh and Ambassador Dasgupta are on 
the GOI's negotiating team in the Major Economies Mechanism (MEM) 
Process and will play a major role in developing India's position in 
the forthcoming United Nations Framework Convention on Climate 
Change (UNFCCC) talks on a post-Kyoto framework, their comments to 
CODEL Pelosi indicate they are feeling the effects of U.S. pressure 
to make real commitments on greenhouse gas emissions.  Their strong 
emphasis on equity and fairness, along with repeated claims of 
Indian poverty, coupled with an exaggerated assertion India spends 
2.67% of it GDP on addressing climate change (this figure ostensibly 
includes monies spent on malaria eradication, local weather 
forecasting, and normal monsoonal drought and flood relief) all 
indicate India is digging in its heels in the run-up to Copenhagen 
¶2009.  END COMMENT. 
 
¶13.  This cable has been approved by CODEL Pelosi. 
 
 
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