VZCZCXRO9638
PP RUEHCHI RUEHDT RUEHNH
DE RUEHHM #0105/01 0240657
ZNR UUUUU ZZH
P 240657Z JAN 08
FM AMCONSUL HO CHI MINH CITY
TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC PRIORITY 3637
INFO RUEHHI/AMEMBASSY HANOI PRIORITY 2463
RUCNASE/ASEAN MEMBER COLLECTIVE
RUEHHM/AMCONSUL HO CHI MINH CITY 3857

UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 03 HO CHI MINH CITY 000105 
 
SIPDIS 
 
SENSITIVE 
SIPDIS 
 
STATE FOR EAP/MLS AND DRL/AWH 
 
E.O. 12958: N/A 
TAGS: PGOV PHUM PREL VM
SUBJECT: CODEL HOYER MEETING WITH FAMILY MEMBERS OF DISSIDENTS 
 
REF: HCMC 0009 
 
HO CHI MIN 00000105  001.2 OF 003 
 
 
Summary 
------- 
¶1. (SBU) HCMC Bar Association lawyers and family members of 
imprisoned dissidents relayed stories of courage and conviction 
during their January 4 meeting with Representative Hoyer and 
members of his delegation. Speaking eloquently about the need 
for greater legal reform in Vietnam, the lawyers called on the 
USG to encourage the GVN to guarantee in law the basic rights 
enshrined in Vietnam's Constitution and to do more to educate 
the public about their legal rights. Though they came with 
diverse backgrounds and viewpoints, the family members shared 
one common desire - to see their family members released soon. 
End summary. 
 
Lawyers Speak Out 
----------------- 
¶2. (SBU) HCMC Bar Association lawyer Le Cong Dinh welcomed the 
delegation and the family members, noting the fact they were 
able to meet freely was a sign of progress considering that in 
April 2007 Representative Loretta Sanchez was prevented from 
meeting the wives of imprisoned dissidents in Hanoi. Mr. Dinh 
noted that the lawyers not only defend human rights activists 
but are also activists themselves, having written many articles 
in the foreign press advocating for greater legal reform in 
Vietnam. Dinh said in the fight for democracy, America's support 
remains very important. Lawyer Dang Dzung agreed that there had 
been progress but added that much remained to be done. He noted, 
for example, that while domestic media outlets all reported 
Representative Hoyer's favorable comments on Vietnam's rapid 
economic growth,they skipped a key part of his statement later 
quoted by Radio Free Asia--that "economic development must go 
hand in hand with the expansion of human rights." The lawyers 
believe one way to encourage progress on human rights is by 
encouraging the GVN to guarantee the basic rights enshrined in 
Vietnam's own Constitution. 
 
¶3. (SBU) Mr. Dzung stated that Chapter Five (Fundamental Rights 
and Duties of the Citizen) of the Vietnamese Constitution 
affirms all of the same rights upheld in the U.S. Constitution, 
including Article 69, which states that Vietnamese citizens 
"shall enjoy freedom of opinion and speech, freedom of the 
press, the right to be informed, and the right to assemble, form 
associations and hold demonstrations in accordance with the 
provisions of the law."  He added that while the Constitution 
upholds these rights, to date, there are no legal provisions 
that protect these rights.  Dzung said in Vietnam, there is a 
popular government slogan -- "Live and work in accordance with 
the law," adding that human rights activists would like to see 
this changed to "Live and work in accordance with the law and 
the Constitution." Noting that the majority of dissidents are 
prosecuted under Vietnam's national security provisions, Dzung 
also said that the war has long been over, and it is time 
Vietnam focused on creating laws that are in line with its 
Constitution. Mr. Dzung ended by noting while the GVN is willing 
to talk to foreign governments about human rights, they have not 
yet begun that conversation with their domestic critics. 
 
Advancing Legal Reform 
---------------------- 
¶4. (SBU) Turning to the situation of the country's dissidents, 
Lawyer Le Cong Dinh noted Vietnamese officials often say "There 
are no religious or political prisoners in Vietnam, only 
lawbreakers." In addition to protecting the rights enshrined in 
Vietnam's constitution, the lawyers said more needs to be done 
to improve the country's legal system. According to the 1985 
Penal Code, lawyers are allowed to get involved in their 
clients' cases right from the investigation phase (i.e, 
discovery, or the pre-trial phase of prosecution), but in 
reality, lawyers have been barred from doing so since the code's 
creation. Official statistics also show that only 20 percent of 
defendants have legal representation. The lawyers said educating 
the public about the legal system was one way to gather support 
for change. Ambassador Michalak agreed, noting he would be 
discussing the possibility of setting up a dialogue between 
Vietnamese lawyers and the Ministry of Justice on legal reform 
issues. In addition, the Ambassador said the U.S. Mission was 
researching ways to get more American legal guides translated 
into Vietnamese, per Mr. Dzung's suggestion (reftel). The 
Ambassador agreed that translating easy-to-use American legal 
texts would help build a public consensus for change as well as 
introduce American legal concepts to a wider Vietnamese audience. 
 
Family Members Share Their Stories 
---------------------------------- 
¶5. (SBU) Mr. Nguyen Cong Hoang, the nephew of imprisoned 
Catholic priest and activist Father Nguyen Ly, said "it is a 
terrible time for dissidents in Vietnam."  Hoang and other 
family members were prevented from attending Father Ly's March 
 
HO CHI MIN 00000105  002.2 OF 003 
 
 
2007 trial, where Ly was gagged by police after he shouted "down 
with Communism" in the courtroom. Since then, Hoang said he and 
his mother have been under constant surveillance by authorities, 
a comment echoed by other family members. Most recently, Hoang 
said local authorities questioned him about his meeting with the 
US Committee on International Religious Freedom during their 
October 2007 visit to Vietnam. 
 
¶6. (SBU) Father Ly's sister Nguyen Thi Hieu said they visit him 
in prison every two months, where he is held apart from other 
prisoners and only allowed to read Phap Luat newspaper (the 
official paper of the Ministry of Justice). He is not allowed to 
say Mass, keep a bible or keep a pen. Though he is allowed to 
write a letter to his family once a month, Ms. Hieu said they 
have never received them.  Ms. Hieu said Father Ly's activism 
stems from his deep religious beliefs, which he feels includes 
the promotion of justice, fairness and human rights. She said 
what Father Ly did in his capacity as a priest was in keeping 
with these principles. Ms. Hieu also feels religious freedom is 
not a reality in Vietnam, "despite what the Vietnamese 
government says." 
 
¶7. (SBU) Le Nguyen Thanh, the brother of People's Democratic 
Party activist Le Nguyen Sang, said the Vietnamese media accused 
his brother of being a terrorist when he was arrested, but these 
charges are untrue. After his brother's arrest, Mr. Thanh 
refuted those claims in an interview with Radio Free Asia and 
said Dr. Sang advocated for free speech, free press, an end to 
police abuses and the expansion of human rights. Thanh noted 
many people in Vietnam, including lawyers, doctors and 
businessmen, are jailed or put under surveillance for saying the 
same things his brother did. 
 
¶8. (SBU)  While two family members declined to speak at the 
meeting, the rest called on the USG to do more to get their 
relatives released. Father Ly's sister said he has missed the 
funerals of both their parents during his time in prison (Note: 
Ly was jailed three times previously and has spent almost 15 
years of his life incarcerated. End note). Ms. Le Ngoc Nghia, 
the mother of dissident Nguyen Bac Truyen, said "I'm 70 years 
old and I visit my son once a month to bring him basic 
necessities.  I just wish my son could return home." Pham Ba 
Dung, the brother of dissident Pham Ba Hai said, "Recently, I've 
seen many good changes in Vietnam.  I'm a businessman and my 
business is doing well. I export 90 percent of my products to 
the United States. I believe that each person should be allowed 
to have a different point of view, but I personally do not want 
to get involved in politics. I do wish, however, that my brother 
could be released and reunited with the family soon. " 
 
¶9. (SBU) Representative Hoyer thanked the family members for 
having the courage to meet and share their stories. He also 
applauded the lawyers for their advocacy efforts.  Rep. Hoyer 
affirmed the USG's support for the release of all prisoners of 
conscience and the need to expand the human rights dialogue with 
Vietnam to include more discussion of Constitutional and legal 
reform issues. He encouraged the family members to stay in touch 
with the Consulate and report any instances of official 
harassment they might experience after the meeting, noting he 
would relay any such incidents directly to the President. (Note: 
Post has been in touch with the family members since Rep. 
Hoyer's visit and none have reported increased harassment as a 
result of the meeting. End note.) 
 
The Participants 
---------------- 
¶10.  The USG delegation: 
Head of Delegation Rep. Steny Hoyer 
Rep. Debbie Wasserman-Schultz 
Rep. Ray Lahood 
Rep. Madeline Bordallo 
Rep. Bob Etheridge 
Ambassador Michalak 
Consul General Fairfax 
Political Officer Katia Bennett 
 
The HCMC Bar Association: 
Mr. Bui Quang Nghiem, Vice President. Nghiem, a member of the 
Communist Party, was co-counsel for the appeals trial of 
dissident lawyers Le Thi Cong Nhan and Nguyen Van Dai.  He also 
represented PDP dissidents in Ho Chi Minh City. 
 
Mr. Le Cong Dinh, Vice President. A U.S.-educated lawyer, Dinh 
was co-counsel for Le Thi Cong Nhan and Nguyen Van Dai.  Dinh is 
also a prominent corporate lawyer whose former clientele 
includes Exxon Mobil, Aventis, and Boeing. Dinh's article 
challenging the Prime Minister to allow private media outlets in 
Vietnam appeared on BBC's Vietnamese news service. 
 
 
HO CHI MIN 00000105  003.2 OF 003 
 
 
Mr. Dang Dzung, Member. Co-counsel for Nhan and Dai, as well as 
jailed PDP activist Le Nguyen Sang.  He was slated to represent 
detained American and Viet Tan activist Do Thanh Cong in August 
2006 before his release.  Dzung, a former Tuoi Tre (Youth) 
journalist, has published over 20 articles for the BBC's 
Vietnamese news service on democracy and other political issues. 
 
Dissident Family Members: 
Mr. Le Nguyen Thanh, younger brother of Le Nguyen Sang and Ms. 
Le Ngoc Nghia, mother Nguyen Bac Truyen. Mr. Sang and Mr. Truyen 
are members of the People's Democratic Party (PDP), an outlawed 
political group that advocates for democracy and multi-party 
elections in Vietnam. Sang and Truyen were sentenced to three 
and four years in prison, respectively, on May 5, 2007 for 
propagandizing against the government.  Their sentences were 
reduced by one year in August 2007. 
 
Ms. Pham Thi Loc, wife Tran Quoc Hien. Mr. Hien is the spokesman 
for the United Workers Farm Organization (UWFO), a group that 
calls for the protection of workers' and farmers' rights and 
expresses strong support for human rights in general. Hien was 
sentenced to five years in prison on May 15, 2007 for creating 
public disorder and propagandizing against the government. 
 
Ms. Nguyen Thi Hieu and Mr. Nguyen Cong Hoang, sister and nephew 
of Father Nguyen Van Ly.  Father Ly is one of the leaders of 
Bloc 8406, an umbrella group for democracy activists that 
supports changing the Constitution to create a multi-party 
government with free elections for the National Assembly and 
protection of civil liberties. Father Ly was sentenced to eight 
years in prison on March 30, 2007 for propagandizing against the 
government. 
 
Ms. Nguyen Thi Trang, wife of Nguyen Ngoc Quang, Ms. Bach Yen, 
wife of Vu Hoang Hai, Mr. Pham Ba Bach and Mr. Le Phuc Hai, 
younger brother and cousin of Pham Ba Hai.  Mr. Quang, Hai and 
Hai are members of the Bach Dang group, which is affiliated with 
Bloc 8406. All three were arrested in September 2006 for 
propagandizing against the government and creating public 
disorder. They were scheduled to be tried on December 27, 2007. 
The trial has now been postponed indefinitely. 
SCHWENK