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DE RUEHHI #1113/01 1300956
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INFO RUEHHM/AMCONSUL HO CHI MINH CITY 1096
RUCNARF/ASEAN REGIONAL FORUM

UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 09 HANOI 001113 
 
SIPDIS 
 
SENSITIVE 
SIPDIS 
 
STATE FOR EAP/MLS, DRL/IRF 
 
E.O. 12958: N/A 
TAGS: PREL KIRF PHUM PGOV SOCI VM
SUBJECT: RELIGIOUS FREEDOM IN THE NORTH PART II: POLOFF 
VISITS HA GIANG PROVINCE, MEETS WITH PROTESTANT AND CATHOLIC 
GROUPS 
 
REF: A) HANOI 1112; B) HANOI 894;  C) HANOI 549 
 
HANOI 00001113  001.2 OF 009 
 
 
This cable continues the report in Ref A. 
 
Summary and Comment 
------------------- 
 
¶1. (SBU) At the recommendation of Protestants in Hanoi, an 
Embassy team visited Ha Giang Province in the third week of 
April to investigate allegations of district-level abuse 
against Protestant groups.  The team was able to discuss 
with officials several serious allegations made against Ha 
Giang provincial and district authorities.  The access to 
local Protestants and the frank and open discussion with 
officials at all levels about the gap between the GVN's new 
framework on religion and its local implementation were a 
significant improvement over previous outreach trips (as was 
the Lao Cai trip reported Ref A).  Based on the team's 
discussions, it appears that the GVN has given strict 
instructions to northern provinces to change their approach 
to our concerns on religious freedom.  While the situation 
for Protestants there has not yet markedly improved, it may 
now be possible for house church congregations to register 
their activities per the law and per Ha Giang's purported 
plans.  We plan to send another team to the region as early 
as June to follow up on these developments.  End Summary and 
Comment. 
 
¶2. (SBU) Poloff and Pol Assistant traveled to Lao Cai and Ha 
Giang provinces from April 23-28 to investigate reports of 
abuse of religious believers and to press provincial, 
district and commune officials to improve their approach to 
Protestants. 
 
¶3. (SBU) In addition to meetings with Ha Giang provincial 
officials, the team met with Xin Man, Bac Quang and Vi Xuyen 
district and commune officials.  The Ha Giang PPC also 
facilitated unprecedented visits to ethnic H'mong villages 
with Protestant residents in each district, including Che La 
Village in Xin Man and Ngoc Lam Village in Vi Xuyen.  Both 
of these village visits were requested by the team in 
advance on the recommendation of Pastor Vinh. In addition, 
the team visited the sub-parish Catholic Church in Bac Quang 
District at the suggestion of Hanoi Archbishop Ngo Quang 
Kiet. 
 
Ha Giang Province 
----------------- 
 
¶4. (SBU) Following the Embassy team's visit with the Bao 
Thang DPC in Lao Cai on April 25 (septel), officials 
escorted the team to the provincial frontier with Xin Man 
district in Ha Giang Province, a three-hour journey over 
rough dirt roads.  The principle single lane road between 
the provinces is under construction and the convoy had to 
take an alternate route at one point because heavy road- 
grading equipment blocked one of the mountain passes.  The 
convoy was met at the provincial line in a remote pastoral 
area by Mai Ngoc Huong, Deputy Director of Ha Giang's 
Provincial Ethnic Affairs Committee, and Hoang Tien Chu, 
Vice Chairman of Xin Man's District People's Commmittee 
(DPC).  A television crew from Ha Giang's local TV station 
recorded the ceremonial arrival. 
 
¶5. (SBU) After a brief lunch in Xin Man Town, Chu invited 
the team to visit the village of Che La in Di Thang Commune. 
The road to the Di Thang base camp across the valley from 
Xin Man proper is only passable in the dry season.  The 
route consists largely of a winding boulder track that 
requires a four-wheel drive vehicle to surmount the many 
obstacles, streams and hairpin turns along its four-hour 
length.  During the drive a Russian-made police jeep in the 
front of the convoy blew out one of its tires and the 
Embassy team vehicle nearly sheared an axle at a 
particularly difficult juncture.  Also, several vehicles in 
the convoy got stuck in the mud and scree and had to be 
extracted at various times.  The convoy reached Di Thang 
after nightfall. 
 
¶6. (SBU) Two representatives of the commune People's 
Committee (NFI) greeted the team and provided a brief 
overview of the social development in the area.  Di Thang 
comprises 1,207 hectares of mountainous land containing 
thirteen villages or 503 household for a total of 2,789 
villagers.  There are two ethnic groups.  Some 58 percent of 
the population is Nung, and the remainder is H'mong.  The 
villagers raise maize and rice along with buffaloes and 
 
HANOI 00001113  002.2 OF 009 
 
 
cattle at an average of one large animal per household. 
They also raise chickens to sell for cash at the closest 
market, which is eighteen kilometers distant.  Close to 98 
percent of the H'mong in Di Thang are Protestant followers 
attached to the ECVN (more than 1,500 total members).  At 
present, there are no officially registered churches in the 
commune, so the Protestants worship in their homes. 
However, five separate congregations have applied to 
officially register as places of worship, the commune 
officials said. 
 
¶7. (SBU) The village of Che La is at the top of one the 
mountains flanking Di Thang's base facility, a hike of 
several hours' duration.  After some discussion, the commune 
officials provided 125cc two-stroke motorcycles and 
experienced drivers for the Embassy team and the provincial 
and district officials.  The path to the village was a mud 
track with numerous switchbacks, rills, shallow streams and 
drop-offs made more dangerous by the pitch dark.  The group 
rode for forty-five minutes until the path was too steep to 
navigate by motorcycle and then hiked the remaining forty- 
five minutes to the top of the mountain.  Chu noted with 
pride that the DPC had recently named this harrowing route 
connecting Che La with Di Thang "The Great National Unity 
Way" because villagers from the surrounding area had all 
worked to build it. 
 
¶8. (SBU) The group entered the first hut reached along the 
path.  It was constructed of compressed earth and thatched 
with straw, but the building was electrified and contained 
several PA system sized speakers, two new TVs and DVD player 
in addition to the open pit fireplace and rudimentary stool 
furniture.  The hut was occupied by a man in his fifties, 
his wife and their two children (NFI).  The H'mong man was 
nervous and subdued in front of so many policemen and local 
officials; however, he became more brazen in his answers 
after Poloff explained why the team was visiting and noted 
the importance of seeing improvements in religious freedom 
for Protestants in the north for our bilateral relationship. 
The man stated that his family has lived in Che La Village 
for generations.  Living conditions have improved 
significantly in the area since 1990.  His family farms 
1,000 square meters of land raising rice and maize.  They 
used to grow manioc as well, but gave it up because the soil 
is so poor.  The man completed fourth grade but quit school 
when he was drafted during the war.  His wife has had no 
schooling.  However, their two children are currently 
studying at the local commune school, he said. 
 
¶9. (SBU) The man said his village consists of 51 households 
or 274 people, all of whom are Protestant.  He and his 
family have been Protestant since 1990.  Before their 
conversion they did not follow any religious traditions at 
all.  The family does not worship at home, but rather 
assembles with others at a house church nearby.  Local 
officials did not allow the villagers to celebrate Christmas 
in 2005, but they did permit each family to conduct special 
observances for Easter this year.  Poloff asked if the man's 
congregation had applied to register with local officials. 
After a quick glance at Chu, he said that "it seems we have 
not applied," but the congregation does wish to affiliate 
with ECVN.  They hope that district and provincial officials 
will coordinate with the ECVN to help them to do so.  Though 
he himself has never been to Hanoi, he added his wish that 
local authorities facilitate his travel to ECVN headquarters 
in the capital to acquire books and materials on 
Protestantism.  At present the congregation does not own any 
bibles, he added. 
 
¶10. (SBU) Poloff asked what Protestantism means to him.  He 
explained that Protestantism means God and God tells us to 
be united and not to do bad things.  Jesus Christ is a God 
who made everything on Earth, including our crops.  Poloff 
asked why the man's family had converted to Christianity. 
He explained that Protestantism is very suitable to the 
H'mong because it "helps us save money and develop a better 
economy."  At this point a number of younger men from the 
village entered the hut.  The man looked at them then 
studied the district officials and finally turned to Poloff 
and said:  "We want you to talk to local officials to get 
them to help us register our congregation with the 
government to allow us to worship and to build a real 
church."  One of the younger men leapt up and asked if 
Poloff wanted to visit the house church.  Before local 
officials could intervene, Poloff accepted the invitation. 
 
¶11. (SBU) The young man introduced himself as the local 
 
HANOI 00001113  003.2 OF 009 
 
 
house church deacon. (Note: This was Deacon Lo Seo Su that 
Poloff met in Hanoi on April 5 (Ref A, Para 7).  Strictly 
Protect.  End Note.)  He took the team up the hill to his 
own hut for a brief introduction to his father and five or 
six other men from the village, and then proceeded up to the 
very top of the mountain (around 500 meters from the first 
hut) to a larger compressed earth structure.  At least 100 
people were in the house church.  They sat divided by sex 
with the colorfully costumed H'mong women occupying the left- 
hand rail stools and the men squatting in more somber 
colored clothing in the shadows on the right.  All light 
came from embers in the pit until a single low-voltage 
lightbulb hanging from overhead was switched on.  As the 
team entered, all of the elder members, male and female, of 
the congregation rose and clustered around Poloff and Pol 
Assistant to shake their hands.  Their excitement was 
electric.  Younger children stared with wide eyes as Poloff 
and Chu squatted in front of the crude wooden cross beside 
the pit fireplace.  Poloff explained the purpose of the 
team's visit and noted the particular importance of this 
unprecedented visit to the Che La house church for our 
bilateral relationship.  He predicted that a day may come 
when more foreigners may visit their village and church on a 
regular basis. 
 
¶12. (SBU) Deacon Su cheerfully explained that this 
particular house church comprises 27 households; another 
church nearby serves the remaining households in Che La. 
Every Thursday evening the congregation meets for psalms and 
each Sunday they meet for prayers.  In addition, every night 
three households get together in the church for individual 
family prayers on an alternating basis.  On Saturday 
afternoons, a choir of young men and women uses the church 
for practice.  Poloff asked the choir to sing a hymn.  Three 
men aged about 20 wearing black and two women of a similar 
age in striped pink and neon green clothes stood and sang a 
H'mong language hymn set to the tune of the American folk 
song "My Darling Clementine."  The women were barely audible 
and the men equally nervous though they sang with a great 
deal of volume.  Vice Chairman Chu gave a short speech to 
conclude the visit exhorting the Protestants to become more 
productive members of society in support of great national 
unity. 
 
Xin Man District 
---------------- 
 
¶13. (SBU) On April 26, the Embassy team met formally with 
Chu and other members of the Xin Man DPC.  Poloff thanked 
the DPC for arranging the team's visit at such a busy time 
for the Government.  He noted that during Ambassador 
Hanford's recent discussions with DPM Vu Khoan, Vice 
Minister of Public Security Nguyen Van Huong and Committee 
on Religious Affairs Chairman Ngo Yen Thi, the GVN 
acknowledged that the Northwest Highlands remains the most 
problematic area of the country on religious freedom, 
particularly with regard to Protestants.  The GVN has made 
registration of Protestant groups a clear domestic policy 
priority in the region over the next six months before the 
President's visit in November.  Ha Giang's openness to frank 
discussion of its failure to register Protestants to date is 
an important step forward, as is Xin Man's willingness to 
allow the team to visit Protestant communities in the 
countryside, Poloff added. 
 
¶14. (SBU) Chu gave a brief overview of the district's recent 
social developments.  There are two main ethnic minorities 
in Xin Man, the Nung and the H'mong.  The Nung constitute 
the majority of the population.  Total area of the district 
is 58,192 hectares.  In the past, there was no religion in 
Xin Man, but since the 1990s Protestantism and the Vang Chu 
phenomenon appeared.  After a period of time Vang Chu 
disappeared.  By 2002, the main religion of Xin Man's 
believers was ECVN-affiliated Protestantism, although some 
were influenced by Southern Evangelical Church of Vietnam 
(SECV) and Christian Missionary Alliance (CMA) missionaries. 
At any rate, by this time a number of H'mong Christians had 
dismantled their families' traditional ancestral altars, 
which led to conflict in some families.  Part of this 
"disruption in solidarity" stemmed from the terrain in the 
district which leaves many villages remote from other 
centers of habitation.  Religion and traditions in these 
areas are only poorly understood in the context of larger 
society.  The confusion of doctrines between the ECVN and 
the SECV and CMA also contributed to this discord, he added. 
 
¶15. (SBU) Chu asserted that as a result of practical 
 
HANOI 00001113  004.2 OF 009 
 
 
decisions taken by the GVN and the Ha Giang PPC on religion, 
Xin Man's DPC has disseminated information on the new 
framework on religion to all cadres and citizens in the 
district.  He noted, however, that these policies were 
promulgated only recently and, though the district has tried 
to implement them, it has been slow to do so.  Poloff made 
familiar points about the importance of implementing the 
PM's Instruction on Protestantism regarding registration of 
Protestant groups.  He asked how many groups in the district 
applied to register.  Chu stated that five groups applied, 
but that they did not do so in a manner that allows the DPC 
to grant them recognition.  For example in Di Thang Commune, 
two separate congregations in Che La Village applied to 
register, but since they live in one village, it should be 
one group and thus one application.  The congregations did 
not consult with the district before submitting separate 
applications and therefore the delay in registration is 
their own fault, he said. 
 
¶16. (SBU) Poloff observed that the bureaucratic problem 
outlined by Chu is not an acceptable reason to hold up 
registration of either group.  The ECVN has complained that 
across the north, local officials use bureaucratic reasoning 
like this to delay the policy of registration. For example, 
in some localities congregations are told that only PPC's 
can accept applications and they have to be submitted 
directly by the ECVN in Hanoi.  In other areas, the ECVN is 
told that only DPC's can adjudicate such requests that 
originate directly from local congregations.  In still other 
locations, the ECVN and the local congregations are told 
that only communes can consider applications, but neither 
ECVN nor the local groups can submit them.  As an example, 
Poloff showed Chu a copy of the returned letter and 
envelopes from the Quan Binh District ECVN congregation 
application that Pastor Vinh provided on April 5 (Ref B, 
Para 2) and noted that the USG and the GVN agree that the 
main problem in the North is the gap between the GVN's 
framework on religion and its local implementation.  It is 
important that the Xin Man DPC undertake to implement the 
law, he said. 
 
¶17. (SBU) Huong replied that it is unfair for Poloff to just 
criticize local authorities in the region.  The ECVN should 
have consulted with the CRA about bureaucratic problems. 
They have never been in direct contact with provincial 
officials.  The ECVN only interacts surreptitiously with 
Protestant groups.  Chu said that the Xin Man DPC's position 
is to facilitate church registration according to the PM's 
Instruction on Protestantism.  In 2006, the district will 
strictly implement the instruction according to circular 
decree Number 5 that orders all local authorities to 
facilitate registration of "groups that have a pure 
religious intent."  Poloff noted that this circular clearly 
instructs local officials to register groups within 30 to 60 
days upon receipt of their application.  It is already four 
months into 2006 and no groups have been registered, even 
though most submitted their applications before October 
¶2005.  Chu replied that the plan is now in place, but the 
district is awaiting formal guidance from the province 
before implementation. 
 
Bac Quang District 
------------------ 
 
¶18. (SBU) Following the meeting in Xin Man, Huong took the 
Embassy team to Ha Giang City, a three-hour trip by car 
along mountain roads.  The road is paved but not graded. 
Officials in the in the PPC vehicle reportedly were car sick 
from the meandering route at high elevation, as was Poloff. 
The road follows the valley of the Chay River.  Many 
terraced fields along the valley walls were abandoned.  PPC 
officials later explained that the local inhabitants left 
the region because the river water is badly polluted by a 
Chinese mine upriver.  Few crops will grow in paddies with 
water taken from the river. 
 
¶19. (SBU) Twenty minutes outside of Ha Giang City, the team 
stopped to visit Bac Quang District's sub-parish Catholic 
church. The church is a low, ramshackle building off of the 
main highway.  The chairman of the Bac Quang DPC as well as 
representatives of the district's ethnic affairs committee 
and the Vietnam Fatherland Front (VFF), the GVN's umbrella 
watchdog of all popular organizations, greeted the team and 
introduced the parish laity.  Nguyen Van Tra, chairman of 
the board of laymen, explained that the church in theory 
belongs to the Hung Hoa Diocese, although in the past Ha 
Giang was its own parish under a different diocese 
 
HANOI 00001113  005.2 OF 009 
 
 
comprising Tuyen Quang and Ha Giang provinces.  The Catholic 
Church has been trying to reconstitute this parish and to 
assign a priest to serve the Bac Quang sub-parish of 106 
households and 450 people.  Ha Giang's PPC has not allowed 
the Church to assign a priest to Bac Quang to date.  (Note: 
Hanoi Archbishop Ngo Quang Kiet has been seeking permission 
to visit Ha Giang to discuss this problem directly with the 
PPC for the last year.  In March, two priests from 
neighboring provinces were permitted to visit the PPC as a 
team to prepare the way for Kiet's visit.  End Note.)  The 
parish is visited by a priest one time a year.  In the 
absence of regular services, the board of laity leads 
parishioners in prayers every Sunday.  Though some new 
Catholics have joined the church by marriage, the parish has 
not grown significantly over the last 30 years, Tra said. 
 
¶20. (SBU) At least one hundred parishioners were present 
when the team toured the church.  Poloff took the 
opportunity to explain to them in front of district and 
provincial officials that under the May 2005 exchange of 
letters with the United States, Vietnam committed to 
improving the conditions for all religious believers. 
Following the February Human Rights Dialogue, the GVN and 
the USG agreed that significant problems remain in Ha Giang 
and the other northern border provinces regarding 
Protestants, but conditions for Catholics are improved.  It 
is therefore surprising that the church has not yet been 
allowed to assign a priest to Bac Quang, he said.  Poloff 
promised to raise this problem directly with the Ha Giang 
PPC as all Catholics in the province should be able to 
worship and conduct religious festivals as they please. 
 
Ha Giang PPC 
------------ 
 
¶21. (SBU) On April 26, Ha Giang PPC Vice Chairman Vuong Mi 
Vang gave a brief overview of social developments in the 
province.  Ha Giang is a mountainous province bordering 
China and is home to many different ethnic minority groups. 
Historically, Ha Giang was originally part of Tuyen Quang 
Province.  Since the split, there has been significant 
improvement in living conditions in Ha Giang, particularly 
in recent years.  Vang noted that the PPC strongly supports 
the framework of U.S.-Vietnam friendship laid out in the 
Joint Statement signed by President Bush and Prime Minister 
Phan Van Khai in Washington last year.  Ha Giang hopes that 
further improvement in this relationship will mean greater 
mutual benefits, including further economic and development 
assistance for the province.  Regarding ethnic minorities, 
he asserted that the PPC always ensures equality among 
ethnicities according to law, especially with regard to 
economic development under the 135 (anti-poverty) Program. 
The PPC also implements Program 134 (land reallocation for 
poor villages) and focuses on providing clean water to all 
communes, he added. 
 
¶22. (SBU) Turning to religion, Vang acknowledged that there 
are four catholic communities in Ha Giang.  Poloff noted 
that the Bac Quang church is in dire need of a priest.  He 
also encouraged the PPC to accept a visit from Hanoi 
Archbishop Kiet to discuss the reconstitution of the Ha 
Giang Parish.  Ha Giang's failure to facilitate Catholic 
worship at a time when Catholics across Vietnam are enjoying 
great improvements in religious freedom is particularly 
unfortunate, he said. 
 
¶23. (SBU) Vang stated that the ECVN and SECV have both 
recognized denominations and groups in Ha Giang. (Note: 
According to the ECVN, Ha Giang has a total of 126 house 
churches comprising 2,178 families, or 13,010 total members. 
End Note).  Both organizations have also sent information to 
the PPC on their activities, including applications to 
officially register a number of congregations.  These 
requests have not yet been approved because these groups 
have not yet legally contacted local officials.  Poloff 
showed Vang the copy of the returned letter and envelopes 
from the Quan Binh District ECVN congregation application 
and observed that technically the local authorities in Quan 
Binh hadn't received an application, but this did not mean 
one hadn't been made.  He reiterated our concerns about 
local officials implementing the GVN's new framework on 
religion and our concerns that local officials are using 
bureaucratic excuses to delay registration of protestant 
groups. 
 
¶24. (SBU) Vang replied that PPC implementation of the policy 
promoting freedom of religion and non-religion has been 
 
HANOI 00001113  006.2 OF 009 
 
 
consistent.  Ha Giang recently conducted a conference for 
district and commune officials to discuss the PM's 
Instruction.  The Provincial Ethnic Affairs Committee has 
also been instructing local cadres so they may teach common 
citizens about religion and the law on religion.  Provincial 
and local officials are thus fully aware of their 
responsibilities to implement the new religious framework, 
he said. 
 
¶25. (SBU) Vang observed that part of the problem is that 
missionary activity in Ha Giang is "not transparent." 
Missionary work is undertaken by many different 
denominations and not just by the ECVN, the one officially 
recognized Protestant church in the North.  These different 
denominations are in competition with each other to "collect 
as many converts as they can."  Furthermore, the 
Protestants' faith is not deeply rooted because Ha Giang is 
not a traditional home for Christians.  Many believers are 
not really familiar with their faiths because of their "low 
level of culture."  Many follow Protestantism "because they 
were told to."  All of this has caused social instability in 
the province and sows distrust among common citizens. 
 
¶26. (SBU) Vang also complained that the ECVN circulated 
application documents to congregations in Ha Giang 
inappropriately.  Nevertheless, as of 2006 the PPC has been 
trying to implement circular Decree Number 5 to facilitate 
Protestant worship.  Vang claimed that outside criticism of 
Ha Giang is based on reports taken out of context.  He asked 
that the Embassy objectively report this so that Vietnam 
will be removed from the list of Countries of Particular 
Concern (CPC).  We are developing a plan to implement the 
laws on religion in the coming months, he added. 
 
¶27. (SBU) Poloff thanked the PPC for arranging the team's 
visit at such a busy time for the government.  He noted the 
importance of religious freedom within the context of the 
bilateral relationship and that it is a regular feature of 
high-level U.S.-Vietnam contacts.  Ha Giang's openness to 
frank discussion of its failure to register Protestants to 
date is an important step forward, as is the PPC's 
willingness to allow the team to visit Protestant 
communities in the countryside.  He urged the PPC to share 
their plan to implement the registration of Protestants with 
the Embassy as soon as it is finalized. 
 
Ha Giang Committee of Mass Mobilization 
--------------------------------------- 
 
¶28. (SBU) On April 27, the Embassy team met with Ly Thin 
Luu, the Deputy Director of the Ha Giang Communist Party 
Committee on Mass mobilization.  Poloff reiterated standard 
points on the importance of registration of northern 
Protestants for the bilateral relationship.  He also 
reiterated concerns about the status of Catholic believers 
in Ha Giang and encouraged the Party to work with the PPC to 
accept a visit from Archbishop Kiet.  Luu noted that Ha 
Giang's population of 600,000 includes people from 22 ethnic 
minorities.  Therefore, the Party and the PPC must respect 
all traditions and religions.  Luu noted that he personally 
ascribes to the traditional worship of the souls of his 
ancestors.  The gods of the mountains and rivers will help 
us overcome our difficulties, even though living conditions 
for ethnic minorities remain harsh in the region and 
economic insecurity has made it hard to ensure peaceful 
coexistence between ethnic groups, he added. Luu 
acknowledged that the attitude of local officials towards 
religion remains problematic, but this is because the Party 
is trying to ensure that new and old customs will be 
mutually beneficial and coexisting.  The local party 
officials support the national policy on religion and are 
working to disseminate information on the policy to all 
levels. 
 
¶29. (SBU) Luu asserted that the PPC has not allowed the 
Catholic Church to assign a priest to the Bac Quang church 
because it has not followed proper procedure.  In Vietnam, 
all organizations, even the Party, must follow procedure. 
For this reason, the Party is taking steps to guide local 
people to apply to register per procedure.  Poloff 
reiterated points about necessity of local government 
obeying both the spirit and the letter of the law.  Luu 
observed that misunderstandings about conditions in Ha Giang 
have led to rumors taken out of context by the international 
media.  He expressed the hope that the Embassy would report 
objectively on conditions in Ha Giang. 
 
 
HANOI 00001113  007.2 OF 009 
 
 
¶30. (SBU) Luu reiterated that the PPC and the Party respect 
the desires of some citizens to turn to Protestantism so 
long as their desires are purely religious.  The Party plans 
to guide people in how to celebrate their religion and how 
to select the best representatives to the outside world. 
Poloff observed that under the framework on religion, it is 
not the Party's role to train people in their beliefs or in 
how to choose their leaders.  Luu replied that it is the 
Party's ultimate goal that citizens practice their beliefs 
in a normal manner while preserving unity.  As in a math 
class where different students have different native ability 
and the teacher leads the class so all can learn, the State 
is trying to preserve social order as some citizens develop 
as Christians faster than others.  "We don't want people to 
be hostile to each other," he said.  Thus, when it comes to 
the registration process for Protestant groups, it is 
difficult to come up with a procedure for knowing if a group 
is in fact Protestant, what denomination they should belong 
to and whether they truly understand the doctrine of their 
faith.  Poloff urged the Ha Giang Party cell to adopt a more 
flexible attitude to religion and the registration process. 
 
¶31. (SBU) Luu replied that the party respects freedom of 
religion, but must ensure good citizenship from religious 
organizations.  For example, the ECVN charter requires a 
group of ten believers in each commune select a leader.  It 
is important that the State verify that such leaders are 
properly chosen.  After many years of war and rebuilding, 
Vietnam is focused on stability.  The Party is concerned by 
anything that causes disruptions and pays close attention to 
ensure that bad elements do not use religion to do bad 
things against the State.  "We will learn from the example 
of other countries in the areas of law, counternarcotics and 
anti-trafficking in persons as we open up our society", he 
added.  Poloff reiterated points about collapse of communism 
in Eastern Europe.  Luu replied "it is my belief that the 
Communist Party is trying to reform itself."  All policies 
must meet the needs of the majority so minorities must make 
adjustments. 
 
¶32. (SBU) Luu reiterated that Ha Giang will facilitate 
registration of Protestants.  "We are trying to decide 
whether the process should start at the provincial level and 
work down, or whether it should begin at the commune level 
and work up," he said.  The next time the Embassy visits Ha 
Giang there will be marked improvements.  Ha Giang will 
welcome visits from any religious organization to help 
ensure this effort succeeds, he added.  Poloff promised to 
inform Archbishop Kiet and Pastor Vinh that their visits to 
Ha Giang are now welcome.  He also promised to return to Ha 
Giang within three to six months.  Luu asked Poloff to pass 
another message to both church leaders:  Ha Giang will be 
happy to receive official delegations, but will not be 
pleased if informal representatives travel through the 
province. 
 
Vi Xuyen District 
----------------- 
 
¶33. (SBU) Following the meeting with Luu, Huong took the 
team to the Vi Xuyen district headquarters, one hour from Ha 
Giang along the national highway. Vice Chairwoman Le Thi Ha 
provided a brief overview of the social development in the 
district.  Vi Xuyen comprises 1,500 square kilometers and is 
home to 89,000 people, including 16 ethnic minority groups. 
The largest ethnic group is the Tay, with 39 percent, 
followed by the Dzao at 22 percent.  The Kinh represent 16 
percent of the population and the H'mong are only the fourth 
largest group, with 11 percent. The topography of the 
district, like much of the north, is notable for its 
mountains and river valleys.  Living conditions in Vi Xuyen 
are still very difficult, and more than half the population 
lives below the 2005 poverty level.  People in remote 
locations live by agriculture and animal husbandry.  The GVN 
has been paying close attention to improving living 
conditions in the district for the past several years, 
providing tuition-free schooling and free medicine for 
ethnic minorities, working to electrify all communes and 
building 1,000 new houses out of wattle and daub frame 
construction for ethnic minorities who used to live in mud 
and straw huts, she said. 
 
¶34. (SBU) Turning to religious freedom, Ha stated that the 
Vi Xuyen DPC has always respected freedom of religion 
according to GVN law, and Ha Giang is currently trying to 
create a framework to protect believers of different faiths. 
The GVN has issued a number of instructions on religion and 
 
HANOI 00001113  008.2 OF 009 
 
 
the district is aware of its responsibility to see these 
regulations fulfilled.  Vi Xuyen has disseminated these laws 
to all cadres, and now the common people have a better 
understanding of religion.  The DPC hopes the Embassy will 
report objectively about the status of religious freedom in 
Ha Giang so that Vietnam will be removed from the CPC list, 
she added. 
 
¶35. (SBU) Poloff reiterated points on the importance of 
improvement in conditions for religions freedom in Ha Giang 
and the north for the bilateral relationship.  He asked 
whether the report from ECVN (Ref B, Para 6) that local 
authorities fined Vi Xuyen house church lay deacons VND 
100,000 VND (USD 6) each for "being Protestant" and for 
signing documents requesting registration for their group. 
Ha stated that since the issuance of the PM's Instruction on 
Protestantism, the DPC has been trying to disseminate as 
much information as possible about it, but it is still quite 
new and Vi Xuyen is very large.  It is hard to disseminate 
this information in a day, she said.  The report on the 
punishment of the individuals in question is based on rumors 
taken out of context.  There is more than one side to every 
story and media reports of such events are inaccurate. 
Poloff noted that he spoke directly with some of the 
individuals involved.  Ha, visibly flustered, explained that 
the believers were fined but not for being Protestant. 
According to Vietnamese law, religious activists must be 
registered with local officials, especially when they wish 
to circulate and use religious documents.  These Protestants 
were not registered and were circulating religious documents 
to make propaganda without permission.  This is why they 
were fined, Ha said. 
 
¶36. (SBU) Poloff noted that these Protestants are caught in 
a Catch-22.  Their house church pastor was fined VND 500,000 
(USD 32), or more than half of his monthly salary, for 
traveling to Hanoi to pick up registration forms from the 
ECVN, even when local officials do not open application 
letters from the Vi Xuyen church.  The Protestants were 
fined for not being registered, but Vi Xuyen won't register 
them.  Poloff made points about the importance of local 
officials respecting both the spirit and the letter of the 
law.  Ha reiterated heatedly and at length that Vi Xuyen 
always treats believers equally before the law.  The DPC is 
trying to maintain Vietnam's great national unity.  There is 
no discrimination against religious believers.  The house 
church pastor was fined not for seeking to register his 
group, but for leaving his village without permission.  In 
any case, religious documents distributed by members of the 
church need to be verified as "the correct documents" by 
local authorities.  Poloff reiterated concerns that local 
authorities are using bureaucratic procedures to delay a 
policy that they do not like. 
 
¶37. (SBU) Huong interjected and reiterated that there will 
be serious action at the provincial level to implement 
Decree Number 5 on religious freedom.  The PPC is now 
preparing a plan to guide implementation by local officials 
at the district and commune levels.  In the near future, the 
Embassy will see dramatic changes in Ha Giang.  Poloff 
should recognize that local officials have done a good job 
on religious freedom to date.  Still, Ha Giang recognizes 
that past incidents have hurt the province's reputation. 
"We agree with the U.S. recommendation to approach religious 
freedom in an open manner," he added.  Ha stated that the 
ECVN should have been in direct contact to discuss past 
problems and its members should adhere to regulations. 
 
Bach Ngoc Commune 
----------------- 
 
¶38. (SBU)Following the meeting with the DPC, the Vice 
Chairwoman and Huong led the Embassy team to Bach Ngoc 
Commune headquarters, a one-hour drive along 20 kilometers 
of dusty country roads that required the fording of several 
large streams.  The commune chairman (NFI) greeted the 
delegation and provided a brief overview of the commune. 
Bach Ngoc comprises 11,900 hectares of land, containing nine 
villages of a total 660 households, or 3,668 people.  There 
are seven ethnic groups living in this community.  The Tay 
are the largest group, representing 40 percent of the 
population.  The H'mong are the second largest grouping. 
Eleven H'mong households in two villages of the commune are 
Protestant and two congregations have applied to register 
their activities to date, but the congregations still 
worship at home.  In 2000, 85 of 87 households in Ngoc Lam 
Village were Protestant, but most have now quit the church 
 
HANOI 00001113  009.2 OF 009 
 
 
because they have discovered "it is not beneficial."  Poloff 
asked whether they left because local officials told them 
to, but the chairman quickly denied that any local officials 
had pressured the Protestants to renounce their faith. 
 
Ngoc Lam Village 
---------------- 
 
¶39. (SBU) The commune chairman led the party to Ngoc Lam 
Village, a short drive to a log footbridge and a kilometer 
hike from the crossing.  Somewhat incongruously, the commune 
provided a traffic policeman to marshall the convoy at 
several difficult turns along the road.  The men of Ngoc Lam 
Village were gathered together in a meeting to discuss 
agricultural issues in the main village culture house.  The 
commune chairman and district chairwoman initially refused 
to invite the Protestant members of this group to meet with 
Poloff, but after a lengthy discussion finally agreed to 
pull two Protestant villagers out of the meeting.  Poloff 
interviewed them in front of the whole village and 30 local 
officials, so the interview had something of the air of one 
of Vietnam Communist Party's infamous "struggle sessions." 
The Protestants were both young men in their twenties.  The 
commune chairman pointedly introduced Giang Seo Pao and 
Giang Seo Man as "the men you've likely met before."  (Note: 
Embassy has never been in contact with either individual 
before.  End Note.)  Pao has completed the ninth grade.  Nam 
never attended school.  Both men confirmed that they have 
been affiliated with the ECVN for about a year, but do not 
know much about Protestant doctrine.  Pao later stated that 
he converted to Protestantism several years ago, but was 
told by local officials that it was illegal, so he left the 
religion and has only recently re-converted.  The men 
worship at home and were not allowed to conduct special 
celebrations at Easter, although they admitted that they do 
not know what Easter actually is.  The Ngoc Lam church has 
applied to register and hopes to build a church soon. 
Poloff took the opportunity to reiterate the importance of 
religious freedom and registration for Protestants in front 
of the large gathering and promised to return soon to check 
up on the progress of the Protestants in the village. 
 
Comment 
------- 
 
¶40. (SBU) As with the Lao Cai visit reported Ref A, this was 
an unprecedented trip.  The Embassy team was able to discuss 
several serious allegations made against Lao Cai provincial 
and district-level authorities.  Access to local Protestants 
and the frank and open discussion with officials at all 
levels about the gap between the new framework on religion 
and its implementation were a significant improvement over 
previous outreach trips.  The visit to the actual house 
church in Xin Man was particularly significant.  It seems 
clear from the reception of the visit at such a sensitive 
political time, and from the repetition of talking points in 
Lao Cai and Ha Giang, that the GVN gave strict instructions 
to northern provinces to change their approach to our 
concerns on religious freedom.  While the situation for 
Protestants in Ha Giang has not yet markedly improved, it 
may now be possible for house church congregations to 
register their activities per the law and per Ha Giang's 
purported plans.  We plan to send another team to the region 
as early as June to follow up on these developments.  End 
Comment. 
 
MARINE