VZCZCXRO4672
PP RUEHCHI RUEHDT RUEHHM
DE RUEHHI #0394/01 0530931
ZNR UUUUU ZZH
P 220931Z FEB 06
FM AMEMBASSY HANOI
TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC PRIORITY 0860
INFO RUEHHM/AMCONSUL HO CHI MINH CITY 0569
RUEHZS/ASEAN REGIONAL FORUM COLLECTIVE

UNCLAS SECTION 01 OF 03 HANOI 000394 
 
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SENSITIVE 
SIPDIS 
 
STATE FOR EAP/MLS AND DRL/IRF 
 
E.O. 12958: N/A 
TAGS: PHUM KIRF PREL PGOV VM
SUBJECT: AMBASSADOR HANFORD MEETS RELIGIOUS LEADERS 
 
 
HANOI 00000394  001.2 OF 003 
 
 
¶1. (SBU) Summary: IRF Ambassador John Hanford met February 
21 with Buddhist and Protestant leaders to discuss issues 
surrounding the practice and management of organized 
religion in Vietnam.  Both the Buddhist and Protestant 
representatives acknowledged progress in the religious 
freedom situation here, but both cited property issues and 
the desire to expand training facilities as key issues of 
concern.  Although GVN officials will openly acknowledge a 
belief in Buddhism, Communist Party members who are 
Protestants will either leave the Party or practice their 
faith quietly.  For the Protestants, the lack of clergy for 
the nearly 120,000 followers in Vietnam's north is a 
significant problem.  Also burdensome are GVN requirements 
surrounding the registration of congregations and the 
requirement to inform local authorities about religious 
activities and leadership decisions.  End Summary. 
 
¶2. (SBU) United States Ambassador-at-Large for International 
Religious Freedom, accompanied by Ambassador Marine, met 
February 21 with Protestant and Buddhist religious leaders. 
In response to Ambassador Marine's opening question about 
relations among religious groups, and whether the GVN 
sponsors an interfaith dialogue, Evangelical Church of 
Vietnam-North (ECVN) General Secretary Au Quang Vinh noted 
that there are few conflicts among religious groups in 
Vietnam.  Nonetheless, there are often informal talks 
between Protestant and Catholic leaders.  Thich Gia Quang, 
Deputy Director of the International Buddhism Department of 
the Vietnam Buddhist Sangha (VBS), observed that there are 
few regular contacts, but that leaders often see each other 
on important occasions. 
 
Issues Surrounding Finding Religion 
----------------------------------- 
 
¶3. (SBU) Turning to the issue of whether religious groups 
perceive competition with each other for followers, and if 
this causes tensions, Thich Gia Quang noted that there is no 
discrimination between or among religious groups in Vietnam. 
All Vietnamese are free to follow or not follow a particular 
faith.  In the case of indigenous religious followers 
choosing to give up family and local traditions for an 
organized religion, the Buddhist leader could not cite a 
specific instance of problems being caused.  If someone 
chose to leave Buddhism for another faith, this would not be 
a problem.  No one is forced to join and, conversely, no one 
can be compelled to remain, Quang said. 
 
¶4. (SBU) Protestants respect the religious beliefs of 
others, Pastor Vinh said.  If someone considers giving up 
traditional practice for Protestantism, then he or she may 
have an internal struggle.  Very often, individuals will 
attend church services and decide to follow Protestantism. 
This naturally is a significant life change, but it happens 
across Vietnamese society, even to Communist Party members, 
Vinh asserted.  In the case of Party members, sometimes they 
will quit the Party to practice Protestantism.  In other 
cases, they will quietly follow Christianity because they 
"do not dare speak out about their faith for fear of 
negatively affecting their position."  However, the 
Protestant church encourages them to talk openly about their 
faith, Pastor Vinh said.  Unlike in China, GVN officials who 
are Buddhist seem to have no problem discussing their faith, 
Ambassador Hanford observed. 
 
¶5. (SBU) Responding to a question about improvements in the 
environment for religious belief compared to five years ago, 
Vinh said that there have been many advances.  For example, 
the number of people attending services in big cities has 
increased, and these believers are often well educated and, 
in some cases, Party members.  There are now many more ways 
to discuss Jesus Christ, and, while some believers still 
feel pressure from family and society, there is less 
pressure than before. 
 
Buddhists See More Success in Addressing Problems 
--------------------------------------------- ---- 
 
¶6. (SBU) On the issue of problems faced by organized 
religion, particularly problems that the GVN could help to 
address, Thich Gia Quang of the VBS noted that a perennial 
issue is funding.  Another problem is related to a number of 
pagodas in urban areas that are being used as housing for 
local residents.  The VBS has urged the GVN to relocate 
these residents and return the property, and the GVN has 
slowly tried to address this matter.  For example, two 
pagodas in Hanoi were returned this year, and the VBS is 
waiting to hear about a third.  The VBS has also sought 
permission to open Buddhist schools and land for Buddhist 
 
HANOI 00000394  002.2 OF 003 
 
 
training centers, and the GVN has generally been responsive, 
Quang said.  For example, the GVN gave the VBS a total of 30 
hectares of land to build two Buddhist training facilities. 
 
Protestants Seek Redress from GVN 
--------------------------------- 
 
¶7. (SBU) The Protestants have had less luck in getting the 
GVN to respond positively to their concerns, Vinh said. 
Like the Buddhists, the Protestants have a number of 
properties that are occupied by outsiders.  In another case, 
a church in Vinh was leveled to construct a park.  There has 
not yet been a response from the authorities to the ECVN's 
request for replacement land.  In another case, a government 
office is now occupying church property, and the GVN has not 
responded to ECVN efforts to recover it.  The ECVN often 
seeks permission to repair and rebuild other properties, but 
to no avail.  The ECVN also would like to build a bible 
training school and additional churches for the more than 
120,000 believers within the ECVN's territory.  The ECVN 
seeks the same treatment as other religions in Vietnam, but 
Protestants are often accused of following an American 
religion, Vinh said. 
 
¶8. (SBU) Several months ago, ECVN leaders sent a letter to 
GVN leadership requesting help with property issues, seeking 
recognition of new congregations and asking for permission 
to open bible training schools.  They also sought a 
resolution of a property issue involving their headquarters 
in Hanoi:  the GVN currently occupies part of their 
property, and the ECVN wants it back.  At present, there are 
only 14 pastors to minister to 130,000 followers in northern 
Vietnam.  Pastor Vinh expressed thanks to Ambassador Marine 
for his help in resolving a property matter in Thanh Hoa 
Province.  In response, the Ambassador offered to continue 
this kind of cooperation with both the Protestants and 
Buddhists, if either group so desires.  These issues take 
time, but focusing on specific cases can help to accelerate 
resolution, the Ambassador observed. 
 
Protestants Lack Clergy 
----------------------- 
 
¶9. (SBU) In response to a question on ECVN cooperation with 
the Southern Evangelical Church of Vietnam (SECV), 
particularly regarding the training of clergy, Vinh 
explained that the SECV does not even have enough training 
capacity for its own needs, let alone the needs of the ECVN. 
Among the 14 pastors in the north, 13 minister to a total of 
7,500 ethnic Kinh Vietnamese.  The one additional pastor is 
ethnic Dao, and his Dao congregation in Lang Son Province 
numbers about 1,400.  In Ha Tay Province, the wife of a 
deceased pastor also ministers to a number of believers. 
For the remaining 120,000 adherents, there are no pastors, 
although there are lay preachers who use bible materials and 
other resources provided by the ECVN.  Overseas Protestant 
organizations have offered to send teachers, but there are 
no schools in which they can teach.  One option the ECVN has 
pursued is to quietly send trainees abroad for a course of 
study that is normally four years, followed by two years of 
practical training. 
 
Slow Registration Process 
------------------------- 
 
¶10. (SBU) Another problem area is the slow registration of 
new congregations, particularly in the Northwest Highlands, 
Vinh continued.  Only one congregation, in Halong City, was 
offered registration, but the congregation has balked 
because of conditions (namely, that the application required 
the believers' workplace addresses, and they feared 
harassment from local officials).  There are over 1,000 
congregations, and over 4,000 meeting points and churches, 
within the ECVN's territory.  The size of each is varied, 
from 20 to 30 members to over 200 followers.  Some are 
mobile, rotating from place to place and altering the times 
of their meetings.  Of the over 1,000 congregations, all of 
which are attached to the ECVN, more than 300 have sought to 
register, and the remainder are waiting to see what happens 
before deciding.  For them, the concern is that registering 
could lead to greater official control, Vinh explained. 
 
Registering Activities 
---------------------- 
 
¶11. (SBU) On the issue of registering activities, Vietnamese 
law requires groups to provide authorities by October 15 a 
calendar of their activities, including major events and 
weekly gatherings, for the year ahead.  This is not a 
 
HANOI 00000394  003.2 OF 003 
 
 
"reapplication," but an "announcement," Vinh said, and local 
authorities will provide feedback.  The law also forbids 
religious activities from taking place outside of designated 
religious facilities.  The ECVN has been doing this for the 
past three years, and, while the system has its good points, 
there are also bureaucratic hassles.  For church leadership 
positions, local authorities need to be informed, and they 
will either accept or reject the church's petition.  There 
are rarely objections, and the few rejections are because of 
"citizenship qualifications," Vinh said. 
 
¶12. (SBU) Thich Thanh Nhieu of the VBS explained that, based 
on the Buddhists' understanding of the law, unless the 
activity calendar for next year differs from that of the 
current year, there is no need to submit a new one for 
consideration by the local authorities.  Furthermore, in 
terms of mechanics, if a group wants to conduct activities 
in a commune, then commune officials bear responsibility for 
making a decision.  If more than one commune is involved, 
then district authorities get involved.  Finally, if more 
than one district is involved, then provincial authorities 
take the lead, Nhieu explained.  The VBS representatives 
noted in closing that there are over 39,000 Buddhist monks 
and nuns in Vietnam, and that there are no age limits or 
restrictions. 
 
¶13. (U) Ambassador Hanford cleared this message. 
 
MARINE