This record is a partial extract of the original cable. The full text of the original cable is not available.


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FM AMCONSUL HO CHI MINH CITY
TO SECSTATE WASHDC PRIORITY 0924
INFO AMEMBASSY HANOI PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY BANGKOK PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY PHNOM PENH PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY VIENTIANE PRIORITY

UNCLAS  HO CHI MINH CITY 000086 
 
SIPDIS 
 
 
SENSITIVE 
 
DEPARTMENT FOR EAP/BCLTV, DRL, DRL/IRF 
 
E.O. 12958: N/A 
TAGS: PHUM SOCI PREL PGOV VM HUMANR RELFREE
SUBJECT: VIETNAM MENNONITE TORTURE CLAIMS UNCONVINCING 
 
REF:  A) 04 HCMC 1574 and previous; B) 04 Hanoi 2886 
 
¶1. (SBU) Summary:  U.S. and Canada-based religious groups 
published reports claiming that two Vietnamese Mennonite Church 
members were tortured throughout their nine-month prison term. 
These reports claimed that the two are under medial treatment for 
severe physical trauma, including potentially life-threatening 
damage.  However, after our interviews of the two men, a review of 
available medical records and a discussion with the doctor that 
examined them immediately after their December 2 release, we 
conclude that the allegations of sustained and brutal torture are 
not credible.  End Summary. 
 
¶2. (SBU) Press releases circulated on the internet by the U.S. and 
Canada-based Mennonite World Conference and California-based 
Compass Direct from mid-January allege that two Vietnamese 
Mennonites, Nguyen Thanh Nhan, 22, and Nguyen Hieu Nghia, 24, 
suffered "non-stop beatings, deprivation and humiliation because 
of their Christian faith."  The two brothers, along with their 
spiritual leader Nguyen Hong Quang, were among six Mennonites 
sentenced on November 12, 2004 for "resisting persons doing 
official duty," stemming from an altercation with police in March 
2004 (reftels).  Nhan and Nghia were released on December 2, 
having completed their nine-month sentence (which included time 
served in pre-trial detention). 
 
¶3. (U) Inter alia, the press releases claim that: "the brothers 
recall loud screams of pain under torture reverberating through 
the cell-block and fading to nothing as, one by one, the brothers 
(and the other Mennonite prisoners) were beaten into 
unconsciousness.  The brothers have had medical exams and are 
under treatment. Doctors were alarmed at what they found. Both had 
untreated broken noses. Nhan still has constant bouts of vomiting 
and Nghia a crippled leg. Both are unable to work." 
 
¶4. (SBU) On January 20, PolOff and Deputy Consular Section Chief 
interviewed the two brothers in separate 90-minute meetings. 
Neither man showed signs of physical or mental trauma.  Their 
gaits and posture were good and handshakes strong.  They were 
friendly, mentally alert and agile.  They were not emotional and 
smiled from time to time.  They arrived and departed from the 
Consulate driving a motorbike, which they were able to use without 
any apparent problem. 
 
Imaginary Scars? 
---------------- 
 
¶5. (SBU) Nhan -- the younger brother -- told us that his cellmates 
stabbed him three times in the stomach and ten times in the back 
and neck with a homemade knife in one particularly vicious assault 
during his first month in prison.  (He said the weapon was a hard 
plastic toothbrush whose base was whittled down to a point.)  His 
brother Nghia claimed that prison guards whipped him with a bundle 
of electric cords on his back until he bled.  Both claimed that 
police beat them throughout their nine-month imprisonment with 
their batons.  Nhan also claimed that, six weeks before their 
trial, approximately mid-September, the police broke his nose 
during a beating.  His elder brother claimed that his nose was 
broken during an assault by inmates. 
 
¶6. (SBU) Poloff showed both men an old scar from a puncture wound 
and asked the two if they had any scars or markings on their 
bodies consistent with the attacks they said they suffered.  They 
voluntarily consented to remove their shirts, but had no scars. 
They explained, "they naturally don't scar." They added that they 
used "warm rice compresses" and a special medicine provided by an 
anonymous benefactor in jail to heal without scarring.  Overall, 
during our interviews, both men repeatedly modified their claims 
about when and who assaulted them as well as the intensity of 
those beatings, shifting the blame for specific alleged incidents 
between the police and prisoners. 
 
¶7. (SBU) The brothers told us that they were placed in cells, each 
holding up to 20 persons, adjacent to each other.  Nghia said 
that, other than "one or two times," he never heard his sibling 
cry out.  He maintained that he never cried out during his alleged 
beatings as such protests would only lead to further retribution 
from the gangs that ran the cells.   (Note: both brothers were 
detained for at least two months at Chi Hoa Prison in HCMC.  They 
alleged they were regularly beaten while in Chi Hoa.  However, 
U.S. citizens also imprisoned at Chi Hoa during the same time did 
not report witnessing or hearing any beatings in the relatively 
small prison.) 
 
No supporting medical evidence 
------------------------------ 
 
¶8. (SBU) During our interview, both men told us that they had seen 
 
the same doctor in Ho Chi Minh City two or three times since their 
release in early December.  They said that the doctor took x-rays 
and put them on a regimen of medicine for back pain and vertigo. 
However, they said they could not recall the name of the doctor, 
the name of the clinic or even the district in which the clinic 
was located.  They said that after their last visit they had 
decided to discontinue Western treatment in favor of herbal 
remedies because Western medicine would take too long to cure 
them.  Asked of their future plans, Nghia said that he would 
continue his studies and help his family on their rice farm in the 
Mekong Delta region.  Neither brother claimed that their injuries 
would hinder their future employment. 
 
¶9. (SBU) At our insistence, Nghia provided us late on January 21 
with a medical record book from Nhat Minh clinic, which claims to 
be affiliated with "Med Net Care Canada."  According to this 
document, Nghia visited the clinic on December 4 and December 12. 
On January 24, we spoke by telephone with Do Than Thuc, the 
attending doctor listed in the record.  Initially, the doctor told 
us that he did not remember the two men, saying the he saw 
"hundreds of patients."  After we mentioned the allegations of 
torture, he recalled having examined two brothers who had told him 
that they had been involved in unspecified beatings.  According to 
the doctor, one brother complained of back pain.  The other 
complained of vertigo and skin problems.  The doctor told us that 
he conducted thorough examinations of the two men, including 
thorough head exams.  The doctor said that he found no physical 
injuries or evidence of beatings or torture in either man.  He 
confirmed that Nghia had a case of scabies, which he treated. 
 
¶10. (SBU) Nghia's medical record adds that x-rays of the spine and 
head were taken and that they did not indicate any head or spinal 
injuries.  The record states that Nghia complained of ill-defined 
stomach problems and vertigo, which he claimed was related to head 
trauma.  The doctor did not support these claims, however. 
 
Were the brothers coached? 
-------------------------- 
 
¶11.  (SBU) Nguyen Thanh Nhan said that neither he nor his brother 
had detailed their allegations to any foreign nationals before 
meeting with us.  However, the wife of Pastor Quang told us in a 
separate phone conversation January 21 that a Canadian activist 
who had an established relationship with Pastor Quang had visited 
with the two men after their release, although she did not know 
for how long or what was discussed.  A contact within the Vietnam 
House Church movement told us that a pastor in the movement had 
spoken with the two brothers immediately after their release and 
that neither had made any claims of abuse at that time.  Our 
contact added that he had met the two brothers on January 20. 
While he was not convinced, he thought that some of the brothers' 
claims of abuse -- particularly by prison gangs -- might have 
occurred.  He did not endorse the brother's claims of police 
brutality, based in part upon on his own experience as a prisoner. 
 
¶12. (SBU) Comment:  To be charitable, it is possible, perhaps even 
likely, that the brothers experienced some physical abuse -- 
particularly from other inmates.  However, their allegations of 
sustained and brutal torture do not stand up to even modest 
scrutiny.  It is notable that our contacts within the house church 
movement -- many of them colleagues of Pastor Quang -- shied away 
from endorsing the claims of the Mennonites.  Pastor Quang and his 
followers appear willing to distort the truth to draw foreign 
attention to religious issues in Vietnam.  Unfortunately, such 
claims undermine the credibility of other, far more serious house 
church organizations seeking to operate freely in Vietnam. 
 
WINNICK 
 
 
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