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Reference ID	Created	Released	Classification	Origin
02ROME1610	2002-03-29 12:55	2011-08-30 01:44	CONFIDENTIAL	Embassy Rome

This record is a partial extract of the original cable. The full text of the original cable is not available.

C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 01 OF 03 ROME 001610 
 
SIPDIS 
 
E.O. 12958: DECL: 03/26/2012 
TAGS: PREL ECON PGOV PREL ECON PGOV PREL ECON PGOV IT EUN ITEUN ITEUN
SUBJECT: AMBASSADOR TOUR D'HORIZON WITH EU AFFAIRS MINISTER 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
 
PAGE 02        ROME  01610  01 OF 03  291341Z 
 
CLASSIFIED BY: AMBASSADOR MEL SEMBLER FOR REASONS 1.5 (B) AND (D). 
 
 ¶1. (C) SUMMARY: DURING A MARCH 26 COURTESY CALL ON EU 
AFFAIRS MINISTER ROCCO BUTTIGLIONE, THE AMBASSADOR DISCUSSED 
THE EU CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION AND THE POLITICAL AND 
ECONOMIC ISSUES SURROUNDING EU ENLARGEMENT.  THE AMBASSADOR 
ALSO ASKED ABOUT THE MINISTER'S RECENT UNHELPFUL COMMENTS ON 
IRAQ, AND POINTED OUT THAT THEY WERE OUT OF SYNC WITH THE 
POSITION OF PRIME MINISTER BERLUSCONI. HE OFFERED TO GIVE THE 
MINISTER A MORE DETAILED BRIEFING ON THE REASONS FOR THE U.S. 
AND ITALIAN GOVERNMENT CONCERNS ABOUT IRAQ.  END SUMMARY. 
 
¶2. (U) THE AMBASSADOR CALLED ON EUROPEAN UNION AFFAIRS 
MINISTER ROCCO BUTTIGLIONE ON MARCH 26. THE MINISTER WAS 
ACCOMPANIED BY HIS DIPLOMATIC ADVISOR. THE AMBASSADOR WAS 
ACCOMPANIED BY POLMC, A/ECMIN AND ECONCOUNS. 
 
¶3. (C) THE AMBASSADOR BEGAN THE MEETING BY NOTING THAT THE 
U.S.-EU RELATIONSHIP WAS A CRUCIAL ONE, OF POLITICAL AND 
ECONOMIC IMPORTANCE TO THE U.S.  THE BILATERAL RELATIONSHIP 
BETWEEN ITALY AND THE U.S. IS VERY STRONG, HE EMPHASIZED. 
THERE WILL, OF COURSE, ALWAYS BE TRADE ISSUES AND OTHER 
IRRITANTS.  HOWEVER, THE OVERRIDING STRENGTH OF THE 
RELATIONSHIP IS THE CRUCIAL ELEMENT.  THE MINISTER AGREED, 
NOTING THAT THE STRONG BILATERAL ALLIANCE ON ANTI-TERRORISM 
AND THE PROTECTION OF PEACE, FREEDOM AND DEMOCRACY ARE KEY. 
EVEN ON TRADE ISSUES SUCH AS STEEL, ITALY HAS KEPT IN MIND 
THE CRUCIAL NATURE OF THE BILATERAL RELATIONSHIP, AND REACTED 
LESS DRAMATICALLY ON THE SPECIFIC TRADE ISSUE, SEEKING 
DIALOGUE INSTEAD OF CONFRONTATION. 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
PAGE 03        ROME  01610  01 OF 03  291341Z 
 
ITALY WITHIN THE EU 
----------------------- 
 
¶4. (C) THE MINISTER SUGGESTED THAT THE EU SHOULD BE 
CONSIDERED AS ONE PART OF THE NORTH ATLANTIC COMMUNITY. 
THE ITALIAN AND UK GOVERNMENTS AGREED ON THIS BASIC TENET, HE 
STRESSED, WHILE OTHERS IN THE EU SEEMED LESS AWARE OF ITS 
TRUTH.  "WE ARE MOVING FROM THE RHINE-CENTERED EU," HE SAID. 
ONCE FRANCE AND GERMANY DOMINATED THE EU, AND ONCE THEY 
DECIDED AN ISSUE, THE EU POSITION WAS DECIDED.  NOW, INSTEAD, 
THERE IS A DIFFERENT LEADERSHIP MODEL. "ALTHOUGH THE UK HAS A 
GOVERNMENT OF THE LEFT, WHILE WE ARE CENTER-RIGHT, WE ARE 
UNITED BY OUR PERCEPTION OF THE CHANGING WORLD.  WE BOTH 
UNDERSTAND THAT THE OLD MODEL NO LONGER WORKS IN A GLOBALIZED 
WORLD."   POINTING TO THE WAY WORLD WARS I AND II HAD SEEN 
TANKS AND AIRCRAFT DESTROY THE USEFULNESS OF TRENCHES AS 
DEFENSES, BUTTIGLIONE REFERRED TO GLOBALIZATION AND LIBERAL 
MARKET ECONOMIES, IN WHICH TARIFFS AND NON-TARIFF BARRIERS 
COULD NO LONGER BE USED TO DEFEND DOMESTIC INDUSTRIES. 
INSTEAD, "WE CAN ONLY DEFEND OUR WORKERS BY GIVING THEM 
SKILLS AND EDUCATION AND HELPING THEM TO RETRAIN WHEN THEY 
LOSE THEIR JOBS." 
 
¶5. (C) ITALY AND GERMANY ARE THE TWO COUNTRIES MOST IN FAVOR 
OF POLITICAL UNITY IN THE EU.  THIS POSITION, HE EXPLAINED, 
WAS NOT DEPENDENT ON THE PARTY IN POWER BUT ON THE HISTORY OF 
THE TWO NATIONS.  "THE MYTH OF THE NATION STATE COLLAPSED FOR 
US IN WORLD WAR II, " SAID BUTTIGLIONE.  WHILE THE BRITISH 
HAD SEEN THEIR RULING CLASS FACE THE SITUATION WITH COURAGE 
AND DECISIVENESS, ITALY AND GERMANY SAW THEIR RULING CLASSES 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
PAGE 04        ROME  01610  01 OF 03  291341Z 
COLLAPSE.   WHILE THE BRITISH NATION STATE FADED GRADUALLY 
OVER DECADES, THAT OF ITALY AND GERMANY IMPLODED OVERNIGHT. 
ITALY AND GERMANY SAW THE EU AS A NECESSITY, WHILE THE 
BRITISH DID NOT.  HOWEVER, BUTTIGLIONE ARGUED, "THE EU IS A 
NECESSITY FOR THE UK TOO."  THE EU IS A CREATION OF ITS 
MEMBER STATES' NATIONAL SOVEREIGNTIES, WITHIN THE 
TRANSATLANTIC FRAMEWORK. 
 
EU CONVENTION 
------------------- 
 
¶6. (C) AS FOR THE EU, THE MINISTER STATED, "WE MUST DO 
TOGETHER ONLY THOSE THINGS THAT WE CAN DO WELL TOGETHER." 
HE INSISTED ON THE NEED FOR SERIOUS REFORMS.  THE EU HAS TOO 
MUCH BUREAUCRACY, AND AT THE SAME TIME DOES NOT HAVE 
SUFFICIENT DEMOCRATIC CONTROL OR TRANSPARENCY.  THESE 
PROBLEMS NEED TO BE RESOLVED IN THE EU CONSTITUTIONAL 
CONVENTION. 
 
¶7. (C) "I'M A GREAT ADMIRER OF THE U.S. CONSTITUTION," 
CONFIDED BUTTIGLIONE.   HE CHARACTERIZED IT AS FLEXIBLE, 
RESPONSIVE TO THE REAL NEEDS OF CITIZENS, UNENCUMBERED BY 
PHILOSOPHICAL CONCEPTS.   MOST IMPORTANTLY, HE ARGUED, IT HAS 
SERVED THE U.S. FROM ITS EARLIEST DAYS THROUGH THE GROWTH OF 
A POWERFUL FEDERAL STATE.   THE EU, HE INSISTED, NEEDS A 
FLEXIBLE, RESPONSIVE AND PRACTICAL CONSTITUTION TO TAKE IT 
 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
                           CONFIDENTIAL     PTQ4315 
 
PAGE 01        ROME  01610  02 OF 03  291342Z 
ACTION EUR-00 
 
INFO  LOG-00   NP-00    AGRE-00  AID-00   ACQ-00   CEA-01   CIAE-00 
      COME-00  CTME-00  DODE-00  DOEE-00  DOTE-00  SRPP-00  DS-00 
      EB-00    EXIM-01  OIGO-00  E-00     FAAE-00  VC-00    FRB-00 
      H-01     TEDE-00  INR-00   IO-00    ITC-01   LAB-01   L-00 
      VCE-00   AC-01    NEA-00   NSAE-00  NSCE-00  OMB-01   OPIC-01 
      PA-00    PC-01    PM-00    PRS-00   ACE-00   P-00     SCT-00 
      SP-00    SSO-00   STR-00   TRSE-00  USIE-00  EPAE-00  PMB-00 
      DSCC-00  PRM-00   DRL-02   G-00     NFAT-00  SAS-00   SWCI-00 
        /011W 
                  ------------------7C6E66  291342Z /38 
P 291255Z MAR 02 
FM AMEMBASSY ROME 
TO SECSTATE WASHDC PRIORITY 3024 
INFO ARAB LEAGUE COLLECTIVE PRIORITY 
EU MEMBER STATES COLLECTIVE PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY ANKARA PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY CAIRO PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY TEL AVIV PRIORITY 
AMCONSUL MILAN PRIORITY 
AMCONSUL FLORENCE PRIORITY 
AMCONSUL NAPLES PRIORITY 
 
C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 02 OF 03 ROME 001610 
 
SIPDIS 
 
E.O. 12958: DECL: 03/26/2012 
TAGS: PREL ECON PGOV PREL ECON PGOV PREL ECON PGOV IT EUN ITEUN ITEUN
SUBJECT: AMBASSADOR TOUR D'HORIZON WITH EU AFFAIRS MINISTER 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
PAGE 02        ROME  01610  02 OF 03  291342Z 
 
FROM THE PRESENT DAY, THROUGH A EUROPE OF NATIONS TO THE 
FEDERAL EUROPE THAT HE BELIEVED WOULD INEVITABLY BE CREATED 
IN THE FUTURE. 
 
THE TRANSATLANTIC RELATIONSHIP 
------------------------------------- 
 
¶8. (C) THE ATLANTIC COMMITMENT, SUGGESTED THE MINISTER, MUST 
ALLOW US TO PARTICIPATE TOGETHER IN MAINTAINING FREEDOM AND 
PEACE AND A SAFE PLACE FOR DEMOCRACIES TO EXIST.  BEFORE 
SEPTEMBER 11, HE ARGUED, THIS WAS NOT SO CLEAR.  BUT SINCE 
SEPTEMBER 11, EUROPEANS HAVE EXPRESSED IN FAR GREATER NUMBERS 
THE NEED FOR BOTH AN EU AND AN ATLANTIC COMMITMENT.   THE 
EVENTS OF THAT DAY REMINDED EUROPEANS THAT THEY AND THE U.S. 
SHARE A COMMON CIVILIZATION -- A COMMON CULTURAL, 
JUDEO-CHRISTIAN HERITAGE.  "EVERY ITALIAN HAD EITHER BEEN TO 
THE WORLD TRADE CENTER OR KNEW SOMEONE WHO HAD.  WE SAW THE 
VICTIMS AS PEOPLE, NOT SYMBOLS, AND WE PARTICIPATED IN THE 
GRIEF." 
 
EU ENLARGEMENT 
-------------- 
 
¶9. (C) THE AMBASSADOR ASKED ABOUT CANDIDATE COUNTRIES FOR 
ENLARGEMENT.  WHICH WERE CERTAIN?  WHICH WERE STILL IN PLAY? 
BUTTIGLIONE RESPONDED THAT ALL BUT CYPRUS AND TURKEY WERE 
CERTAIN.  TURKEY WOULD NOT MAKE IT.  PROSPECTS FOR CYPRUS 
WERE IMPROVING, BUT IT WAS NOT YET CERTAIN TO ENTER.  ASIDE 
FROM THE GREECE-TURKEY ISSUES, CYPRUS HAD TO DO MORE AGAINST 
ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION. 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
PAGE 03        ROME  01610  02 OF 03  291342Z 
 
¶10. (C) AS THE CONVERSATION TURNED TO RUSSIA, THE MINISTER 
STATED THAT RUSSIA WOULD NOT BECOME A MEMBER OF THE EU IN THE 
FORESEEABLE FUTURE.  HE COULD CERTAINLY SEE POSSIBILITIES OF 
ASSOCIATION AND PARTNERSHIP FOR RUSSIA AND THE CIS, 
STRENGTHEN.  HOWEVER, THE BOTTOM LINE WAS THAT THE EU COULD 
NEVER AFFORD TO GIVE RUSSIA ACCESS TO THE GENEROUS COMMON 
AGRICULTURAL POLICY AND STRUCTURAL FUNDS.  RUSSIA WOULD 
BANKRUPT THE EU. 
 
IRAQ 
---- 
 
¶11. (C) MINISTER BUTTIGLIONE HAD MADE SOME UNHELPFUL 
STATEMENTS REGARDING IRAQ, CLAIMING THAT U.S. MILITARY ACTION 
AGAINST IRAQ WOULD BE INHUMANE AND SHOULD NOT TAKE PLACE. 
THE AMBASSADOR EXPLAINED THE CONTEXT OF HIGH LEVEL 
DISCUSSIONS ON IRAQ AMONG WORLD LEADERS, AND THAT PRIME 
MINISTER BERLUSCONI WAS IN ACCORD WITH THE U.S. PRESIDENT. 
EMBASSY POLMC SUGGESTED THAT THE MINISTER MIGHT FIND IT 
HELPFUL TO BE BRIEFED ON IRAQ AND ITS PROGRAM TO BUILD 
WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION, AS WELL AS THE EFFORTS THE U.S. 
HAS MADE TO RESOLVE THIS.  THE MINISTER EXPRESSED INTEREST. 
 
¶12. (C) BUTTIGLIONE WENT ON TO EXPLAIN THAT HIS COMMENTS IN 
NO WAY INDICATED SUPPORT FOR IRAQ.  HE NOTED THAT ITALY WAS 
NEAR ENOUGH TO IRAQ TO BE THREATENED WITH "NON-CONVENTIONAL 
WEAPONS."  HOWEVER, HE SAW THE ISSUE IN TERMS OF THE 
PALESTINIAN SITUATION.  "IN ORDER TO CREATE A MILITARY 
BUILD-UP AGAINST IRAQ, WE NEED TO CREATE A COALITION OF ARAB 
STATES AS PART OF IT.  THERE IS NO WAY THEY WILL JOIN US 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
PAGE 04        ROME  01610  02 OF 03  291342Z 
UNLESS WE HAVE SOLVED THE PALESTINIAN PROBLEM.  ONCE WE DO 
SOLVE THE PALESTINIAN PROBLEM, SADDAM WILL SEE THAT HE HAS NO 
SUPPORT, AND GIVE IN."  HE ADDED THAT ONCE THE PALESTINIAN 
ISSUE WAS RESOLVED, ITALY PROPOSED A "MARSHALL PLAN" FOR THE 
MID-EAST THAT WOULD STABILIZE THE REGION.  ALL THIS WOULD 
LEAD TO EITHER AN OPENING FROM SADDAM OR A BREAKDOWN OF HIS 
REGIME.  NO OUTSIDE FORCE WOULD BE REQUIRED. 
 
¶13. (C) THE AMBASSADOR REJECTED THIS LINE OF REASONING.  HE 
EMPHASIZED THAT SADDAM HAS NO MORE INTEREST IN PALESTINE THAN 
DOES OSAMA, AND REMINDED THE MINISTER THAT IRAQ HAS A PROGRAM 
OF WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION, AND THAT INSPECTORS ARE NOT 
ALLOWED INTO THE COUNTRY.  HE RENEWED THE OFFER OF A BRIEFING 
ON THE SITUATION, AND THE MINISTER ACCEPTED. 
 
¶14. (C) COMMENT:  BUTTIGLIONE, PHILOSOPHER BY TRAINING, IS A 
THOUGHTFUL COMMENTATOR WITH A DEEPLY HUMANISTIC -- AND ROMAN 
CATHOLIC -- WORLD VIEW.  HIS ITALY IS GROUNDED IN EUROPEAN 
GEOGRAPHY, BUT ALSO IN EUROPEAN CULTURE, RELIGION AND 
HISTORY.  A LONGSTANDING CRITIC OF MILITARY ACTION AGAINST 
IRAQ, HE APPARENTLY BELIEVES THAT SOCIAL AND ECONOMIC 
MEASURES CAN EFFECT CHANGES IN POLITICAL BEHAVIOR, EVEN IN 
DIFFICULT CASES SUCH AS IRAN AND IRAQ.  HIS PREFERENCE FOR 
DIALOGUE AND COMPROMISE OVER CONFRONTATION MAY PUT HIM 
OCCASIONALLY AT ODDS WITH OUR MORE DIRECT STYLE, ALTHOUGH HE 
CAN STILL BE COUNTED FIRMLY AMONG THE FRIENDS OF THE U.S. 
 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
                           CONFIDENTIAL     PTQ4316 
 
PAGE 01        ROME  01610  03 OF 03  291342Z 
ACTION EUR-00 
 
INFO  LOG-00   NP-00    AGRE-00  AID-00   ACQ-00   CEA-01   CIAE-00 
      COME-00  CTME-00  DODE-00  DOEE-00  DOTE-00  SRPP-00  DS-00 
      EB-00    EXIM-01  E-00     FAAE-00  VC-00    FRB-00   H-01 
      TEDE-00  INR-00   IO-00    ITC-01   LAB-01   L-00     VCE-00 
      AC-01    NEA-00   NSAE-00  NSCE-00  OMB-01   OPIC-01  PA-00 
      PC-01    PM-00    PRS-00   ACE-00   P-00     SCT-00   SP-00 
      SSO-00   STR-00   TRSE-00  USIE-00  PMB-00   DSCC-00  DRL-02 
      G-00     NFAT-00  SAS-00     /011W 
                  ------------------7C6E6A  291343Z /38 
P 291255Z MAR 02 
FM AMEMBASSY ROME 
TO SECSTATE WASHDC PRIORITY 3025 
INFO ARAB LEAGUE COLLECTIVE PRIORITY 
EU MEMBER STATES COLLECTIVE PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY ANKARA PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY CAIRO PRIORITY 
AMEMBASSY TEL AVIV PRIORITY 
AMCONSUL MILAN PRIORITY 
AMCONSUL FLORENCE PRIORITY 
AMCONSUL NAPLES PRIORITY 
 
C O N F I D E N T I A L SECTION 03 OF 03 ROME 001610 
 
SIPDIS 
 
E.O. 12958: DECL: 03/26/2012 
TAGS: PREL ECON PGOV PREL ECON PGOV PREL ECON PGOV IT EUN ITEUN ITEUN
SUBJECT: AMBASSADOR TOUR D'HORIZON WITH EU AFFAIRS MINISTER 
 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
PAGE 02        ROME  01610  03 OF 03  291342Z 
SEMBLER 
 
                       CONFIDENTIAL 
 
> 
 2002ROME01610 - Classification: CONFIDENTIAL

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Viewing cable 02ROME1610, AMBASSADOR TOUR D'HORIZON WITH EU AFFAIRS MINISTER